The Problem With Men, with Scott Galloway | What Now? with Trevor Noah Podcast (YouTube Video Transcript)

(00:00:00) Your YouTube transcript will appear here (00:00:00) [Applause] (00:00:01) [Music] (00:00:01) [Applause] (00:00:04) I realized that if someone wasn't (00:00:05) interested in me, someone didn't want to (00:00:07) hire me, someone didn't want to invest (00:00:09) in my company, I was going to be just (00:00:11) fine. It didn't get in the way. I ran (00:00:13) for sophomore, junior, and senior class (00:00:15) president. I lost all three times based (00:00:17) on my track record. I decided to run for (00:00:18) student body president where I went on (00:00:20) to wait for it, lose. But recognizing no (00:00:23) is not the worst thing in the world is (00:00:26) the key skill. And young men because of (00:00:29) a low entry, lowrisk entry into (00:00:32) relationships with bots or AI sex dolls (00:00:35) or up porn have decided they no longer (00:00:38) want to tolerate no. That is the key. (00:00:40) But I would suggest if you do get the (00:00:42) no, don't say you're fine. You can say I (00:00:45) felt rejected. You can say I felt like a (00:00:47) loser. You can say I felt like I can't (00:00:49) get a woman. You can say all these (00:00:51) things. But I think it's important with (00:00:52) anti-fragility to say but I know I will (00:00:55) be fine. I'm still here. There's still (00:00:57) going to be tomorrow. It's not the end (00:00:59) of the world. It's [ __ ] and you're (00:01:00) embarrassed and you feel stupid and all (00:01:02) these things, but I love what you say (00:01:03) like you will be fine. (00:01:10) This is What now with Trevor Noah. (00:01:17) [Music] (00:01:22) Where you coming in from, by the way? (00:01:23) Oh, well I'm I have a place. I live in (00:01:25) London, but I have a place. You live in (00:01:27) London? I do. What part of London? (00:01:29) Marleon. Oh. What made you choose (00:01:30) London? I'm from I grew up there. Uh I'm (00:01:32) in around this stuff. I'm an influencer, (00:01:34) not a decision maker. My wife told me we (00:01:36) were moving uh 5 years ago. Sound like a (00:01:38) great husband. Yeah. Uh well, I'm on the (00:01:41) road a lot. So she says I don't get a (00:01:43) vote. Is your wife British? No, she's (00:01:45) actually born in Poland, raised in (00:01:46) Germany. Both my parents are initially (00:01:48) from the UK. So I was one Oh, nice. So (00:01:50) you have the citizenship? Uh, I have (00:01:53) duel. Okay. Uh, I was almost drafted (00:01:55) when the Faulland Islands crisis broke (00:01:57) out, which my mom was not anticipating. (00:01:59) Wow. Yeah. So, your parents are British, (00:02:01) but you were born in America. Born in (00:02:03) America. Yeah. And did your parent are (00:02:05) your parents still in America? Uh, my (00:02:07) mom's pass. My mom passed. My dad is is (00:02:09) in San Diego. Oh, so they they like (00:02:11) stayed. Oh, yeah. Does he still have his (00:02:13) accent? Oh, it's it's a Scottish accent (00:02:15) and Oh, he's a Scotsman. I Yeah. If I (00:02:17) could give my sons anything, it would be (00:02:19) a Scottish accent. And what made your (00:02:21) parents leave um the UK? You know, they (00:02:25) just wanted a better life. I think why a (00:02:26) lot of people came here. They came here (00:02:28) when they were 19 and 22, respectively, (00:02:30) on a steam ship. From Glasgow and (00:02:31) London, respectively. And man, your (00:02:33) dad's from Glasgow. Well, Glasgow was a (00:02:36) bad I'm from London, South London. Okay. (00:02:38) I came out two in 2014. (00:02:41) You've been here a while. Um so, yeah, I (00:02:43) was came out when I was like 26, just (00:02:46) about to turn 27. I've been here 10 (00:02:48) years now. But I'm thinking about what (00:02:50) my exit is and when I I talk to Trevor (00:02:52) about it all the time. Oh, really? We (00:02:53) should talk about that. Yeah. I'm just (00:02:54) like, I'd like to have a foot in each (00:02:56) world. Like, how can I build my career? (00:02:58) So, I'm like partially in LA, partially (00:03:00) in London. Cuz I don't know how you (00:03:01) feel, but I found London very like (00:03:04) grounding and like grounded in a way (00:03:06) that I haven't found in the US. Um, as (00:03:10) much as US has lots of opportunity and (00:03:12) all of that, I'm just like I think about (00:03:14) that a lot. We should talk about it. (00:03:15) Yeah, we're talking about it. Oh, we (00:03:16) are. Are we recording? Yeah, we're (00:03:18) recording. Oh god, welcome to the (00:03:19) podcast. I'll be infinitely more (00:03:20) charming and insightful then. Um, (00:03:23) so the way I would distill the (00:03:25) difference between the US and Europe is (00:03:27) the US is still the best place to make (00:03:28) money and Europe's the best place to (00:03:30) spend it. So my crude reductive analysis (00:03:32) on someone at your age is you're (00:03:34) probably still in the making money part (00:03:35) of your face. There's more opportunities (00:03:37) that will bump off of you in the US than (00:03:38) will in triple the time in Europe. But (00:03:41) once you get to a point of economic (00:03:42) security and you start thinking about (00:03:44) lifestyle, Europe's a much more (00:03:46) civilized, same place. It's great for (00:03:48) kids. Yeah, I've got three kids. You can (00:03:50) get a much better bottle of wine for 10 (00:03:52) bucks in Spain than you can anywhere in (00:03:53) the US. Uh the people are friendly, but (00:03:56) the reality is the opportunities and the (00:03:59) risk capital just isn't there. For every (00:04:01) company in the US, there's 5 million (00:04:02) venture capital. For every company in (00:04:04) Europe, there's 1 million. So, there's (00:04:06) just not nearly the risk aggressiveness (00:04:08) uh and the opportunities to make money (00:04:10) in Europe as there are here. So, I (00:04:13) always say if you're as I was when I was (00:04:14) your age, I was very economically (00:04:16) focused. I wasn't trying to be a better (00:04:17) person or find a family or change the (00:04:19) world. I was trying to be rich. And (00:04:21) America is absolutely the best place to (00:04:22) establish economic trajectory. Once you (00:04:25) have money, peace out to Europe. So this (00:04:27) is actually a question I had for you. (00:04:29) You know, I I think when you say the (00:04:31) name Scott Galloway, depending on who (00:04:34) you say it to, depending on where (00:04:36) they've seen it, they have a completely (00:04:37) different idea of you, which which I (00:04:39) actually love. Like I know some people I (00:04:40) said Scott Galloway is going to be on. (00:04:42) Immediately some of my friends are like, (00:04:43) "Man, finally talk about masculinity. We (00:04:45) got to talk about being men. We got to (00:04:46) talk about then I say to some of my (00:04:48) friends, Scott Galloway is on. They're (00:04:49) like, "Yes, talk to the man about (00:04:50) capitalism. Talk to him about tax, you (00:04:52) know, the business work. We we got to (00:04:53) talk about then you I'm on with Scott (00:04:55) Galloway." They're like, "Oh, man. (00:04:56) Please talk about like what's going on (00:04:57) in America and what's happening in the (00:04:59) world?" And the conversation organically (00:05:01) started in where you are, where you see (00:05:03) the world, where you see America. Do you (00:05:05) think that what's happening in America (00:05:07) is bad or do you think there almost (00:05:09) needs to be a new I don't want to call (00:05:12) it a new world order, but like Yeah. (00:05:14) If if we think of a world without like (00:05:16) borders the way we've drawn them, right? (00:05:18) There used to be this general trajectory (00:05:20) of people. They would work in a small (00:05:22) town or live in a small town, grow up (00:05:23) somewhere, move to the big city to make (00:05:25) money, and then generally they'd migrate (00:05:27) back to the small town at some point. (00:05:29) Now, if you think about generations that (00:05:31) came to America before then they left (00:05:33) the small town, but on another (00:05:34) continent, they've come to the big town (00:05:36) that is America. They've made the money, (00:05:39) but now there's no moving back. Do you (00:05:40) think like America's always just going (00:05:42) to be about making money? Yeah. And (00:05:44) where do you think that where do you (00:05:44) think that leads us? Um, ultimately, I (00:05:47) think what's going on is mostly bad. I (00:05:49) think that there's a series of 80-year (00:05:53) alliances, the post World War II order (00:05:55) that was based on trust, reciprocity of (00:05:57) free trade, a general notion that (00:06:00) America might get it wrong, but our (00:06:01) heart was in the right place and that we (00:06:03) believed in rights, women's rights, (00:06:05) civil rights, democracy. We would push (00:06:08) back on autocrats. We would push back on (00:06:10) war criminals. And those alliances feel (00:06:13) like or that playbook feels like and (00:06:15) maybe we're taking it for granted has (00:06:16) been ripped up. And just distinct of the (00:06:19) morality of what I think is unforgivable (00:06:21) surrendering to a murderous autocrat. (00:06:23) Put the morals aside and just talk about (00:06:25) it economically. We have some of the (00:06:28) best trading relationships and mutual (00:06:30) reciprocity agreements with the largest (00:06:32) economies in the world. We trade. We get (00:06:35) along. We trust each other. We're (00:06:36) willing to go arm-in-arm with each (00:06:39) other. Let's look at Canada. largest (00:06:40) undefended border in the world. That (00:06:42) says something about our friendship. (00:06:44) Open trade. They led us into World War (00:06:46) I. We followed them. They were in World (00:06:48) War II before us training Allied pilots. (00:06:51) I love the test of that wonderful, very (00:06:54) emotional test of friendship that the (00:06:56) Holocaust survivor said to Buffett when (00:06:59) she was saying, "Who are your real (00:07:00) friends?" She said, "My test is, I (00:07:01) think, would they hide me?" That is a (00:07:03) very (00:07:05) puncturing question. Yeah. Right. And (00:07:08) the reality is in the 1979 hostage (00:07:09) crisis, the Canadian embassy, they hid (00:07:12) us. They hid six American diplomats, (00:07:15) taking enormous personal risk to get (00:07:17) them out of the country, and then they (00:07:18) stayed behind. And if they've been (00:07:20) caught, there's a good chance they would (00:07:21) have been hanged by crane. So the (00:07:22) Canadians are willing to hide Americans. (00:07:25) They are really true friends. And right (00:07:27) now, we're in a situation where they (00:07:28) don't even understand where why we're (00:07:30) trying to levy so much damage on their (00:07:32) economy. So this postWorld War II order (00:07:36) that America has been sort of the leader (00:07:38) in is being ripped up. And I don't think (00:07:40) it's a good idea. The silver lining I (00:07:42) like to think what could go right. I (00:07:44) struggle with anger and depression. So I (00:07:46) consistently ask myself what could go (00:07:48) right. What could go right is that (00:07:50) possibly Europe is finally a union. And (00:07:52) that is they realize their rich uncle (00:07:55) has lost his [ __ ] Yeah. That no trust (00:07:57) fund. We cannot count on the $800 (00:08:00) billion military umbrella and the (00:08:03) economic um what I'll call consistency (00:08:05) and rational thinking of America. And (00:08:08) they are talking about increasing their (00:08:09) defense budget from 1.9% of GDP to 3%. (00:08:13) And I think that's stimulus. I think (00:08:14) Europe actually coordinating because of (00:08:16) the crisis around a lack of American (00:08:18) leadership. The EU economy is $19 (00:08:21) trillion. Russia is 2 trillion. Russia's (00:08:23) actually smaller than Canada. So there's (00:08:25) no reason that if the EU gets it [ __ ] (00:08:27) together and starts coordinating and (00:08:28) increasing their military budgets, they (00:08:29) shouldn't be able to push back on Russia (00:08:31) all on their own. And I think that (00:08:33) stimulus and also the spillover of (00:08:35) technology might actually create an (00:08:38) upward spiral of economic growth in the (00:08:40) in Europe. So I'd like to think the (00:08:42) silver lining here is that some of the (00:08:44) most advanced civilized democratic (00:08:46) economies in the world and some of the (00:08:47) most robust economies are quite frankly (00:08:50) getting their [ __ ] together that Europe (00:08:51) is a union for the first time in a long (00:08:53) time. Mhm. Some would argue that like (00:08:56) that stimulus is part of the reason that (00:08:58) we're in the problem we're in today. You (00:09:00) know, building our economies around the (00:09:02) military, spending our money and and (00:09:04) really getting things going by sort of (00:09:06) getting wars going. And we we've seen (00:09:07) we've seen the effect that it has on an (00:09:09) economy. You go to war, things start (00:09:10) moving. You know, people start getting (00:09:12) paid, things start getting made, but (00:09:14) it's also war. But it's also war. And (00:09:15) like scholars who know far would when I (00:09:19) sit with them they'll say to me you know (00:09:21) the US has always been very bad at (00:09:23) actually understanding where Russia is (00:09:26) versus where Russia says it is. You know (00:09:28) and like one of the the more (00:09:30) um salient examples was when Russia (00:09:33) invaded Ukraine and the tanks were (00:09:35) falling apart in the mud. You remember (00:09:37) that? And and I remember analysts were (00:09:39) shocked. They're like, "Well, these (00:09:41) tanks are trash." And we didn't know (00:09:42) that Russia, it doesn't look like (00:09:44) Russia's infrastructure is as robust as (00:09:47) we thought it was, the military (00:09:48) infrastructure, right? And I couldn't (00:09:49) help but think back to like the days of (00:09:51) Gorbachev and all of these like, not (00:09:52) that I was there, but like when I when I (00:09:54) watch documentaries and I read and I go, (00:09:56) Russia's bluffed for so (00:09:58) long and America has responded to that (00:10:00) bluff for so long that some people argue (00:10:03) that it's just a war of bluff that never (00:10:05) ends. Mhm. And some would say, and I (00:10:08) wouldn't be the one who says it, but I (00:10:10) always like to consider these crazy (00:10:11) ideas. Some would say, although Trump (00:10:14) may be doing it in the wrong way, he's (00:10:16) the person who's breaking this thing, (00:10:19) and it may lead to the right conclusion. (00:10:21) How do you How do you, you know, cuz I (00:10:23) know you're always thinking about the (00:10:24) pros and the cons of everything. Do you (00:10:26) think in a weird way Trump might be (00:10:29) doing the right thing in the wrong way (00:10:30) that get gets the world to a better (00:10:32) place, or do you think it was better for (00:10:34) it to continue the way it was? (00:10:36) Yeah, I don't I think on the whole this (00:10:38) is not good for America and the West. (00:10:40) And I would just want to acknowledge (00:10:41) that Eisenhower, a general, warned of (00:10:44) the military-industrial complex. He (00:10:45) said, "If you build a privatized (00:10:47) shareholder gains based on a war (00:10:49) machine, you're going to invent reasons (00:10:50) to need the war machine." Having said (00:10:52) that, I would argue that we on the left (00:10:55) are sometimes naive about the fact that (00:10:58) the moment some bad actors believe they (00:11:02) can come for us and take our Netflix and (00:11:03) our espresso away, they will. and that I (00:11:06) actually am a bit of a war hawk and (00:11:07) believe in a very strong defense. I (00:11:09) would also argue that just economically (00:11:11) two points if you look at the most (00:11:13) valuable companies in the world whether (00:11:14) it's Apple or Google they're built on (00:11:16) the backs of middle class investments (00:11:18) visa v the defense department so GPS (00:11:20) which is what all mobile technology is (00:11:22) based on was initially a technology (00:11:24) developed for ICVMs to put them in the (00:11:26) pocket of Gorbachef (00:11:28) DARPA which is what the internet is is (00:11:30) built on was made by an extraordinary (00:11:31) investment meant to create a hubless (00:11:33) communications network for so we could (00:11:34) communicate with each other after the (00:11:36) Russians nuked us. So I would argue the (00:11:38) military spending for the most part in (00:11:40) the US has been I would argue a net (00:11:43) positive. Now that's not to say that it (00:11:45) should anyway rationalize entry into (00:11:47) Southeast Asia or into Iraq. These are (00:11:49) disastrous positions. Now as it relates (00:11:52) to let me go to Ukraine. I think of a (00:11:55) manager as somebody who's just supposed (00:11:57) to allocate capital to a greater return (00:11:58) than your peer group. That's their job (00:11:59) as managers. The job of the president is (00:12:02) he's the biggest capital allocator in (00:12:03) history. I would argue that the decision (00:12:05) to allocate $60 billion a year to (00:12:07) Ukraine is one of the best investments (00:12:09) that has ever been made in the modern (00:12:11) world. In exchange for that $60 billion, (00:12:13) to your point, we've kind of defanged (00:12:15) the reputation of this supposedly (00:12:17) ferocious army of Russia. It was 5 days (00:12:20) and and Kee's fallen, right? That did (00:12:23) not happen. We've taken out a third of (00:12:24) their kinetic power, a third of their (00:12:26) tanks and much of their navy has been (00:12:28) taken out. Also, Russia is not a good (00:12:30) actor towards us. their intervention or (00:12:31) introduction to our economy is to seal (00:12:33) our IP and attack us from a cyber (00:12:35) security. So them being focused on a (00:12:37) failed war, a a def a defenistration of (00:12:40) their quote unquote ferociousness and (00:12:42) also sending a signal to the world that (00:12:44) when the west binds together, we are a (00:12:47) formidable fighting force. And all of (00:12:49) this was without a single boot on the (00:12:52) ground from America. In addition, that (00:12:55) $60 billion a year, somewhere between 70 (00:12:57) and 90% of it, has come back to the US (00:12:59) to manufacture weapons, mostly in red (00:13:02) states. So for about 8% of our military (00:13:04) budget, we are keeping a bad actor (00:13:07) occupied, reducing their military (00:13:09) kinetic power and sending a message to (00:13:12) the world that the west is a formidable (00:13:15) backer of even a small motivated army. I (00:13:17) think this is the best money we have (00:13:19) spent in a long time. Well, the thing (00:13:21) is, Scott, I think the reason why what (00:13:24) Trump is doing, if from a geopolitical (00:13:27) perspective, it's like a bad decision if (00:13:30) we think about the real politic. But to (00:13:32) the regular American who's worried about (00:13:35) the price of eggs, y right, who is just (00:13:37) like, I'm worried about my employment. (00:13:39) I'm worried about the schools my kids go (00:13:41) to. I'm worried about the housing crisis (00:13:44) that's ongoing. And they hear, you sent (00:13:46) how much to Ukraine? Y. So, how do we (00:13:49) kind of speak to those people and get (00:13:50) them to see the other perspective? I (00:13:52) think it's through numbers and data. In (00:13:53) terms of the very real justifiable (00:13:56) argument of like there's a lot of (00:13:57) problems here. We should be focusing all (00:13:59) our capital here. (00:14:01) This the $75 billion in USA, the $60 (00:14:03) billion in Ukraine, I would argue, is (00:14:05) nothing but a weapon of mass distraction (00:14:07) to get you to look away from the fact (00:14:10) that the tax cuts that Trump is about to (00:14:13) implement will increase our deficit for (00:14:15) by $800 billion. And the problem is (00:14:18) Democrats don't speak in language that (00:14:19) people can understand. This is what a (00:14:21) deficit is. A deficit is a tax on you (00:14:23) and your children in 10 to 30 years. It (00:14:25) crowds out investment in technology and (00:14:27) education that create more growth. It (00:14:30) crowds out our ability to um have (00:14:33) programs for younger people. Basically, (00:14:35) our debt, our entire federal budget is (00:14:38) moving towards senior citizens. 40% of (00:14:41) everything goes to people over the age (00:14:42) of 65. Interest on our debt and the (00:14:44) military. So, we can't make these (00:14:45) forward-leaning investments that benefit (00:14:47) you and you're going to have to pay it (00:14:48) back. Not me. I'll be dead by the time (00:14:50) we run out of credibility and the (00:14:51) Treasury market fails. So, all of this (00:14:54) nonsense around let's not invest in (00:14:56) Ukraine, USA, bring the money home. The (00:14:59) DOA $2.6 billion in savings so far (00:15:02) according to the Wall Street Journal. If (00:15:04) you want to 6x the savings from DOA, (00:15:06) stop all subsidies to Tesla. So, your (00:15:09) job is to allocate capital. So I think (00:15:11) the helicopter crash was DEI DOA only (00:15:14) male and female the gulf of cheaper (00:15:17) eggs. It's all a misdirect from the most (00:15:20) irresponsible spending that we're about (00:15:22) to incur. And that is you're about to (00:15:24) incur a future $800 billion tax every (00:15:27) year such that I can make more money. (00:15:30) That essentially America has become (00:15:32) about our fiscal policies have become (00:15:34) the following. give me your credit card (00:15:36) so I can be in the club doing rails and (00:15:38) champagne and all you get to do is pay (00:15:40) for it in the form of deficit. 60 (00:15:42) billion is is a decent amount of money, (00:15:44) but it's nothing like the $800 billion a (00:15:46) year we're going to lose in deficit (00:15:49) spending. I think US aid is an amazing (00:15:51) investment for people around the world (00:15:52) to feel good about America. I think (00:15:55) pushing back on Russia for $60 billion a (00:15:57) year and setting a signal that we are (00:15:59) willing to sacrifice for democracies and (00:16:02) and repel murderous autocrats. I think (00:16:04) that's an outstanding investment. $800 (00:16:06) billion a year to give me a tax cut. Bad (00:16:09) idea. And all this other [ __ ] is just a (00:16:11) misdirect to get you to look away from (00:16:13) what is about to happen. And that is the (00:16:15) biggest tax increase in history on you (00:16:17) and your children. You know, listening (00:16:20) to you speak sometimes I I I think to (00:16:23) myself, it's often easy for us to focus (00:16:25) on a problem in the moment and not ask (00:16:28) ourself who played what role in helping (00:16:31) us get there. Right? I like that you (00:16:34) brought up like the Democrats or (00:16:35) progressives or left-leaning people. You (00:16:37) know, that that old saying, a system (00:16:38) isn't what it says, it is what it does. (00:16:40) first part of it when we talk about like (00:16:44) what people could be doing and should be (00:16:45) doing when the Democrats had the power (00:16:47) Yeah. and they were able to do the (00:16:49) things. You can't help but look at the (00:16:51) disparity between what Trump does even (00:16:54) illegally, let's call it, with executive (00:16:55) orders or, you know, beyond his power. (00:16:57) He does the thing. Forget whether you (00:17:00) like the man or not. He does the thing (00:17:02) that he said he's going to do. The (00:17:03) Democrats when they've had the power (00:17:05) that they had, didn't do the things that (00:17:07) they say they're going to do. I mean, (00:17:08) Biden was pretty significant about (00:17:10) climate change and infrastructure. Yeah, (00:17:11) this is this is this is in in in the (00:17:13) term that they had with the power that (00:17:14) they had. And that's true. He has been (00:17:16) one of the more significant presidents. (00:17:18) But like what do you think they have (00:17:21) missed there or what do you think we are (00:17:23) missing in that side of the equation (00:17:25) where there's even that meme that I (00:17:26) think captures it perfectly where it's (00:17:28) like Democrats in power. We don't have (00:17:30) enough power. Democrats out of power. We (00:17:32) don't have enough power. You know what I (00:17:33) mean? It's like is that a system that's (00:17:35) broken or is it two sides that are (00:17:37) playing a game very differently? It's a (00:17:39) really thoughtful question. So when you (00:17:41) hear Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren (00:17:43) rail about billionaires and that we need (00:17:44) a progressive tax structure, which I (00:17:46) think is accurate, there's some nuance (00:17:48) there in the sense that so I'll take you (00:17:50) as an example, Trevor. I imagine you (00:17:52) make an extraordinary living, but it's (00:17:54) current income. Meaning if you live is (00:17:55) your home here, are you a New York (00:17:57) resident? You're probably paying 50 or (00:17:58) 52% tax% tax because the majority of (00:18:01) your income is current income and you're (00:18:03) you make enough money to be in the (00:18:04) highest tax bracket. Now, I've made my (00:18:07) living starting and selling businesses, (00:18:09) and now I make my living buying and (00:18:10) selling stock. My tax rate, I'm a (00:18:13) Florida resident now, has been 17% for (00:18:15) the last 10 years. When Damn, I'm doing (00:18:18) things wrong. (00:18:19) Well, here's the thing. The people that (00:18:20) get screwed are the super earners. And (00:18:22) then your tax rate plummets when you (00:18:24) become a super owner. So, when I was in (00:18:26) my 30s and 40s making an extraordinary (00:18:28) living as a consultant or as a writer, I (00:18:30) was paying 30 35 45%. Once I became a (00:18:34) super owner, my tax rate plummeted. And (00:18:36) this has been a conspiracy that both the (00:18:38) Democrats and the Republicans have (00:18:39) fmented. And where they come together is (00:18:41) the following. And that is democracy (00:18:43) over the last 30 or 40 years in terms of (00:18:45) rights has become solely a function of (00:18:47) how rich you are. Any woman in my life (00:18:50) will have access to me. I could be in (00:18:52) the deepest reddest part of America and (00:18:54) if someone I know has an unwanted (00:18:56) pregnancy, we're going to have no (00:18:58) problem. If they start rounding up (00:19:00) people and people say that could never (00:19:01) happen in America, [ __ ] It happened (00:19:03) 80 years ago. We started rounding up the (00:19:04) Japanese despite the fact many of their (00:19:06) children were serving in the European (00:19:08) market fighting in our uniform. It could (00:19:10) absolutely happen here. I think we're (00:19:11) one economic shock away from and who (00:19:13) knows who the group will be. It might be (00:19:14) Muslims, I don't know, or immigrants. I (00:19:17) I think it could get very ugly very h (00:19:19) fast. It's not a threat to me. I'm rich. (00:19:21) I can peace out to Dubai. male (00:19:24) some of that some of that although just (00:19:27) to comment on that I actually think in (00:19:29) America and this is a collective victory (00:19:31) and we should celebrate it I think you (00:19:33) would rather be more non-white or gay in (00:19:35) America right now than poor I think I (00:19:37) mean but they they intersect the group (00:19:40) most huge van over yeah the group most (00:19:43) likely but you would ra say that line (00:19:44) again though but you would rather be (00:19:45) born to in today's America and this is a (00:19:49) sign of our collective victory but (00:19:51) should also inform how we allocate (00:19:52) resources and lift people up. (00:19:55) Affirmative action should be based on (00:19:57) color and that color should be green and (00:19:59) then you're going to help a lot of (00:20:00) people of color. Yes. 70% overlap. But (00:20:03) here's the bottom line. 70% is (00:20:05) significant. Trevor Noah's kids, you (00:20:06) don't need any help, right? Your kids in (00:20:09) America today, and we should celebrate (00:20:11) this. You'd rather be born non-white or (00:20:14) gay than poor. The academic gap between (00:20:17) black and white 60 years ago was double (00:20:20) between rich and poor. It has flipped. (00:20:23) But Scott, don't you think it's still (00:20:24) concerning that 70% of the people who (00:20:27) are poor are people of color? But then (00:20:29) the question is, how do we help them? (00:20:31) Letting in the Taiwanese daughter of a (00:20:33) billionaire is not diversity. I mean, (00:20:36) I've never I've never felt that's (00:20:37) diversity. 60 years ago, there were 12 (00:20:40) blacks at Harvard, Princeton, and Yale (00:20:42) combined. That's a problem. Mhm. (00:20:44) Race-based affirmative action made sense (00:20:46) this year. 60% of Harvard's freshman (00:20:48) class identify as non-white. But here's (00:20:51) the thing. 70% of those kids come from (00:20:53) upper income homes. So where should we (00:20:57) go? I think most Republicans and almost (00:20:59) all Democrats agree that some people are (00:21:01) born with wins in their face that (00:21:02) deserve a little bit of help. By the (00:21:04) way, I'm talking my own book. I got Pell (00:21:05) Grants. My mother lived and died a (00:21:07) secretary. We were generously upper (00:21:09) lower middle class. So I got unfair (00:21:11) advantage in the form of Pell grants (00:21:13) because I came from a household that was (00:21:14) considered in the bottom cortile. I (00:21:16) think that's where it should be now. But (00:21:18) what we have in the US is a conspiracy (00:21:21) between the 1% and any administration (00:21:23) that says you don't need to worry. You (00:21:25) don't need to speak up. You're the most (00:21:27) powerful, but [ __ ] about it to your (00:21:30) friends and ring your hands about what's (00:21:32) going on, but you're not going to come (00:21:33) out and speak about it. You're not going (00:21:35) to refuse to go to his inauguration. (00:21:36) They're not going to refuse to give them (00:21:38) a million bucks because this is the (00:21:40) bottom line. The rich, right, are (00:21:43) protected by the law, but they're not (00:21:44) bound by it. And the poor in this (00:21:46) country are are bound by the law, but (00:21:49) not protected by it. Your rights and (00:21:51) your democracy have never been better if (00:21:53) you're in the 1%. But the whole point of (00:21:56) American constitutionality and democracy (00:21:58) is that it's meant to protect the bottom (00:22:00) 50. Rich people don't need democracy. (00:22:03) They don't need rights because they have (00:22:04) money. I have more rights than any (00:22:06) individual in history because I'm rich. (00:22:09) And that's what America has become. It's (00:22:11) become an operating system for (00:22:12) transferring rights and money and (00:22:15) democracy to the 1% at the cost of the (00:22:17) bottom 99. It is total [ __ ] It is (00:22:20) unamerican and is the conspiracy (00:22:22) emerging. And the reason why so many (00:22:23) rich people are being quiet is because (00:22:26) they're like me. They upload their W2s (00:22:28) to Chat GBT. I'm going to save 930 grand (00:22:31) this year if the Trump tax cuts go (00:22:33) through. So stop. Stop. It hurts so (00:22:35) good. That was a mouthful. No, but I (00:22:38) love it because everything you're saying (00:22:39) for me, you know, speaks. It's funny. (00:22:42) You and I had this conversation. A lot (00:22:43) of what you're saying now is what (00:22:45) chairman Fred Hampton of the Black (00:22:47) Panthers said at some point when he (00:22:49) mobilized a coalition of poor people, (00:22:52) the rainbow coalition, Martin Luther (00:22:53) King, don't forget the white poor. He (00:22:55) said, he said, "When they tell us black (00:22:57) and when they tell us white and they're (00:22:59) forgetting the thing that connects all (00:23:00) of us, poor." And he said to that group (00:23:02) of people in that church that he (00:23:03) gathered, he said, "Hey, listen. You may (00:23:04) call me the n-word, and you may say (00:23:06) these things, but he said, "But look at (00:23:07) your bank balance and look at our bank (00:23:09) balance. We have something in common. (00:23:11) So, I'm not your enemy." 100%. (00:23:14) We're going to continue this (00:23:15) conversation right after this short (00:23:17) break. (00:23:22) [Music] (00:23:25) So, like when when we when we think (00:23:26) about that like when we think about (00:23:28) politics through that lens, Yeah. Did it (00:23:31) fall apart when America said that, you (00:23:33) know, companies or money is speech, you (00:23:36) know, like Citizens United. Is is that (00:23:38) when it fell apart? Or was this like a (00:23:40) gradual creep? Was this the inevitable (00:23:42) conclusion of a place that was built on (00:23:44) the idea of just money and the most (00:23:46) money wins? And I I do want to say (00:23:48) something. It's actually shown that when (00:23:51) black people do acquire some wealth or (00:23:53) high income, because of the communities (00:23:57) we're connected to, a disproportionate (00:23:59) amount of that income goes to other (00:24:01) family members or friends. So, black (00:24:02) rich is actually very different from (00:24:04) white rich. If we talk about that black (00:24:06) kid at Harvard or Princeton, maybe they (00:24:09) are like one or two generations away (00:24:11) from having someone who wasn't a college (00:24:13) graduate. So, I think we should be (00:24:14) careful when we do talk about like the (00:24:16) black affluent class. you're apparently (00:24:19) getting all these handouts, right? But (00:24:21) but if I'm hearing what Scott's saying (00:24:22) and and you'll correct me if I'm wrong, (00:24:24) it's similar to there was an author that (00:24:26) I I spoke to once from the UK and she (00:24:29) had this brilliant dissertation where (00:24:30) she she essentially said, "I cannot wait (00:24:34) for America to get over its race war to (00:24:37) then realize that it's been a class war (00:24:39) all along." But in America, specifically (00:24:42) in America, you cannot separate the race (00:24:45) from the class. But even when you get (00:24:46) past it, let's say tomorrow we wipe away (00:24:49) color, then the real game begins. Then (00:24:51) you'll be like, "Oh, wait a minute. Now (00:24:53) we see what was peeled away." And to (00:24:55) your point, class has become a signifier (00:24:58) of race and race has become a signifier (00:24:59) of class. They're intertwined. But even (00:25:01) when you dismantle them, you will then (00:25:03) realize that they're not actually they (00:25:05) just happen to be intertwined in I mean, (00:25:06) I don't think the solve for all of this (00:25:09) is black people, Asian people, whatever (00:25:10) group to become rich or even the solve (00:25:12) that we have for the the white male (00:25:14) crisis. Is that what you're saying (00:25:15) though? I don't think that's what you're (00:25:16) saying. Well, so if you to to be fair, (00:25:19) to acknowledge the point, so if you look (00:25:22) at (00:25:23) um there is still an economic apartheid (00:25:25) in the United States, Latino and black (00:25:27) households have an average wealth of (00:25:29) $20,000. White households 150. So it's (00:25:32) hard not to acknowledge and it's going (00:25:34) to deepen with the great wealth transfer (00:25:35) that's going to happen with the boomers. (00:25:37) I think we have to acknowledge that when (00:25:38) the boomer generation pass on their (00:25:39) wealth, they're calling it the great (00:25:41) wealth transfer. And that is going to (00:25:42) deepen the inequity between black (00:25:45) minority groups and white in in deep in (00:25:49) ways that is unprecedented. There's some (00:25:51) nuance though when you normalize it. And (00:25:52) when you compare black and Latino (00:25:54) households with a college education to (00:25:56) white households with a college (00:25:57) education, things get things get (00:25:59) normalized or evened out. They don't (00:26:01) they're also most more likely to live in (00:26:02) a poorer neighborhood. The New York (00:26:04) Times did a great story on affluent (00:26:07) black people who had the same income and (00:26:09) white people. I think we're falling into (00:26:11) the trap of the following. I think that (00:26:13) the algorithms and the incumbents want (00:26:16) us to be thinking it's black versus (00:26:18) white and it's the old. Quite frankly, (00:26:20) old people figured out they could vote (00:26:21) themselves more money and an average (00:26:23) 7-year-old is 72% wealthier than they (00:26:25) were 40 years ago and the average person (00:26:27) your age is 24% less wealthy than they (00:26:29) were 40 years ago. Every economic policy (00:26:32) in America is meant to transfer wealth (00:26:35) from the lower 99 to the top one and (00:26:37) specifically from the young to the old (00:26:38) and who it impacts most is people of (00:26:42) color and poor people. And the question (00:26:44) is how do we move to a solution? So what (00:26:46) I wanted to say is I completely agree (00:26:48) with you and I think what you have is a (00:26:50) very fair reading but I worry about us (00:26:52) losing the nuance of the in of the (00:26:55) collective experience that certain (00:26:56) groups in this country have that are (00:26:58) different. That's why I say to me it (00:26:59) sounds like you're saying the same (00:27:00) thing. That's what that's what I'm (00:27:01) saying. So when I look at it from two (00:27:03) different places, it's almost like one (00:27:04) is meditative and one is contemplative. (00:27:06) Right? What Scott is saying is (00:27:10) if you blindfolded said we are going to (00:27:13) help poor people in this country, more (00:27:16) black people would be helped and more (00:27:18) Latino groups would be helped because (00:27:20) they are the people who are more poor. (00:27:22) However, tons of white people will be (00:27:23) helped because there are tons of poor (00:27:26) white people as well. So he's going what (00:27:28) the promise of America is being (00:27:29) neglected right now to people who are (00:27:31) being left behind because we're moving (00:27:33) to a society where it's more like an (00:27:34) oligarchy than it is an actual (00:27:37) meritocracy. You know it's all about the (00:27:39) compounding of the money versus you know (00:27:41) where your rights are in relation to (00:27:42) you. And now what you're saying is even (00:27:44) when we're building these systems we (00:27:46) mustn't forget who's been left behind. (00:27:48) No I just want to use a model. The (00:27:49) University of California which saved my (00:27:51) ass uh I think had the right approach in (00:27:54) 1997. and they did away with race-based (00:27:56) affirmative action and they went to (00:27:57) what's called an adversity score. What (00:27:59) is your background? Do you come from a (00:28:01) single parent household? Do you come (00:28:02) from an economically strained household? (00:28:03) Do you come from a household where (00:28:04) someone is incarcerated? And by the way, (00:28:07) the overlap that's genius. The overlap (00:28:10) is 70%. But what it also solves for is (00:28:13) the fact that quite frankly, Trevor, (00:28:14) your kid should not get affirmative (00:28:16) action. Yeah, I agree. And I don't even (00:28:18) have a kid, Christian, stop bullying. (00:28:20) This is what happens. the identity (00:28:22) politics ends up enraging this. How did (00:28:26) we elect an insurrectionist as (00:28:28) president? That's an honest question. (00:28:30) And I think this is what happened. If (00:28:32) you look at the groups that pivoted (00:28:34) hardest from red um from blue to red, (00:28:36) 2020 to 2024, it was three groups. It (00:28:39) was Latinos who in my opinion gagged on (00:28:42) the notion that because of their (00:28:43) identity, they were expected to vote (00:28:45) some one way. Mexican-Americans in LA (00:28:47) are much different and have different (00:28:48) priorities than Cubanameans in southern (00:28:50) Florida. they pivoted the hardest. The (00:28:52) second biggest pivot was people under (00:28:53) the age of 30 who for the first time in (00:28:55) the nation's history aren't doing as (00:28:57) well as their parents were at 30. That's (00:28:59) never happened before. The third group (00:29:01) that pivoted hardest to the right were (00:29:03) women aed 45 to 64. And I believe I (00:29:06) believe that's the mothers of young men (00:29:08) who are failing. This was supposed to be (00:29:11) an election on or a referendum on (00:29:13) women's rights. We thought that's what (00:29:15) was going to save us for those of us who (00:29:17) who supported Vice President Harris that (00:29:19) women's rights were going to step into (00:29:22) the fold. Women's rights did not show (00:29:24) up. It was not a big swing vote in this (00:29:27) election. What showed up quite frankly (00:29:29) was struggling young people and their (00:29:31) parents. Because if your kid is in the (00:29:34) basement playing video games and vaping, (00:29:35) you don't give a [ __ ] about territorial (00:29:37) sovereignty in Ukraine. You don't care (00:29:38) about transgender rights. That's a (00:29:39) luxury rich rich Democrats get to have. (00:29:42) Not us. my kids aren't doing well. And (00:29:45) so they voted for chaos and change. And (00:29:47) this guy is so coarse, so (00:29:49) unconventional, so kind of non-bullshit (00:29:51) quite frankly, that you saw people pivot (00:29:54) hard from blue to red. Okay. And now (00:29:56) this is where I bring in the race stuff, (00:29:58) right? Black women overwhelmingly voted (00:30:00) for Vice President Harris. Whose sons in (00:30:03) this country are doing the worst? Who is (00:30:05) going from the school to prison (00:30:06) pipeline? Who was disproportionately (00:30:08) impacted by um the marijuana being (00:30:12) illegal? who's disproportionately (00:30:13) interrupted by the castal state whether (00:30:15) it's being stop and frisk it is black (00:30:17) men in this country% so why didn't black (00:30:19) mothers do that because we care about (00:30:21) our sons too I know I care about my son (00:30:23) why didn't they make the same decision (00:30:24) and their sons are also they're not in (00:30:26) prison if they're not in prison they're (00:30:28) downstairs playing video games as well (00:30:30) but the data you're missing is the (00:30:32) following black women overwhelmingly (00:30:34) voted for Vice President Harris but more (00:30:36) of them voted for Trump than they did in (00:30:38) 2020 Oh yeah I can tell you why that is (00:30:40) why is that some of the immigr ation (00:30:42) sentiment really resonated. Really (00:30:45) resonated. And Trese talks about it all (00:30:47) the time, the idea of black jobs. A lot (00:30:49) of people laughed at Trump when he said (00:30:50) that thing about black jobs. But for a (00:30:53) lot of black women, they're like, I know (00:30:55) the jobs he's talking about, the jobs (00:30:56) that my brother used to do or my uncle (00:30:58) did or my father did. So I think the (00:31:00) immigration sentiment also spoke to (00:31:02) them. and also VP Harris, they weren't (00:31:05) some black women weren't fans of her and (00:31:07) they didn't feel like they should have (00:31:09) to vote for her based on their identity. (00:31:12) But I just I kind of rub up against the (00:31:14) idea that this cohort of white women (00:31:18) voted because they're worried about (00:31:19) their sons. I think perhaps they wanted (00:31:20) to be protected under patriarchy, which (00:31:22) is a very rational decision. And I don't (00:31:24) I mean I may have feelings about it, but (00:31:26) I like they're probably siding with (00:31:27) their husbands. That's that's a strange (00:31:29) phenomena. And that is a lot of women (00:31:30) will vote for what they perceive as best (00:31:32) for their husbands and their sons. Yeah. (00:31:34) But we all thought at least I thought I (00:31:37) thought Roie Wade being overturned. Roie (00:31:39) Wade's another example. But those women (00:31:40) don't these women can't have babies that (00:31:42) shifted. Like they're not worried about (00:31:44) getting an abortion. They're in (00:31:45) menopause. Fair enough. But I mean I'll (00:31:49) give you another interesting stat where (00:31:51) Trump was really brilliant. I'm (00:31:52) fascinated by how he won. We're on a (00:31:54) podcast, (00:31:55) right? Trump flew into the manosphere. (00:31:59) crypto rockets. Joe Rogan, he flew right (00:32:02) into the manosphere. He said, "I am (00:32:03) worried about young men. I relate to (00:32:05) young men. I am coarse, aggressive." He, (00:32:08) this was, this wasn't the women's (00:32:10) referendum election. This was the (00:32:12) testosterone election. And he flew right (00:32:14) into the manosphere. And quite frankly, (00:32:16) it was brilliant. By him going on Rogan, (00:32:18) 40 million video views, 15 million audio (00:32:20) downloads. He got more attention in 90 (00:32:23) minutes than Kla. If Kla Harris wanted (00:32:25) the same level of attention, exposure, (00:32:27) she would have had to go on had to have (00:32:28) gone on (00:32:29) MSNBC, CNN, and Fox every night for (00:32:32) three hours for two weeks. She (00:32:34) absolutely should have flown down to (00:32:35) Austin. He saw the opportunity to appeal (00:32:38) to struggling young men and the people (00:32:40) concerned about them. And by the way, (00:32:41) the struggles I talk about, I talk about (00:32:43) struggling young men a lot. They're even (00:32:44) more acute for young men of color. Yeah. (00:32:47) A boy is twice as likely to be suspended (00:32:49) as a girl on a behavior adjusted basis. (00:32:51) Same exact infraction in school. A boy (00:32:53) is twice as likely to be suspended. A (00:32:55) black boy is five times as likely to be (00:32:58) suspended. So we have an education (00:33:00) system that is not only biased in my (00:33:02) opinion against males, it's really (00:33:04) biased against male. All these problems (00:33:06) I talk about with men, whether it's (00:33:08) suicide, opiate addiction, homelessness, (00:33:10) it's especially acute among non-white (00:33:13) men. But this is something you going (00:33:16) back to your question, when did this (00:33:17) happen? I feel like America our lack and (00:33:21) I'm an atheist so I'm not suggesting (00:33:22) that church is the answer but as a (00:33:25) nation becomes wealthier its reliance on (00:33:27) a super being bing and church attendance (00:33:28) goes down but into that void fall we (00:33:31) still need answers so we try and find (00:33:33) idols and the new Jesus Christ of our (00:33:35) economy are technology innovators tech (00:33:38) billionaires because the [ __ ] feels like (00:33:40) magic and these people create trillions (00:33:42) in wealth so we're fascinated by them (00:33:45) and I think where we came off the tracks (00:33:46) is this idolatry of money. When I was a (00:33:48) kid, my dad's boss had a slightly bigger (00:33:50) house, but we all went to the same (00:33:52) country club. We all went to the same (00:33:53) school. Money buys you everything from (00:33:57) better healthcare to better schools to a (00:33:59) much broader selection set of mates. So, (00:34:01) we have become obsessed, (00:34:04) understandably, with money. The idolatry (00:34:07) of the dollar and these tech innovators (00:34:09) has gone berserk. And so, the pursuit of (00:34:12) the dollar, in my opinion, has crowded (00:34:14) out almost all traditional character. (00:34:17) When the wealthiest man in the world and (00:34:19) probably the most admired man in the (00:34:21) world is making Nazi salutes, we (00:34:24) normalize that [ __ ] Why? Because he's (00:34:26) really [ __ ] rich. Look what money has (00:34:29) done to us. Look what it's done. If you (00:34:31) had a friend who was making Nazi salutes (00:34:33) at parent teachers conferences and was (00:34:35) being sued by two women for sole custody (00:34:38) their kids and you had heard from (00:34:40) credible sources that they were addicted (00:34:41) to ketamine, wouldn't you move in and (00:34:43) say, "Hey boss, something's wrong here." (00:34:46) But not if you're rich. Not if you can (00:34:48) put a rocket into space or make a [ __ ] (00:34:51) ton of money with EVs. Money has (00:34:53) perverted us. It has crowded out all (00:34:56) sense of character, of decency, of what (00:34:59) it means to be a real man. We have (00:35:01) decided that you can get away with (00:35:02) anything as long as you're rich. It's (00:35:05) been a total, in my opinion, a lack of a (00:35:07) moral failing. We used to admire cops. (00:35:09) We used to admire people who were were (00:35:11) had fidelity to their religion. We used (00:35:13) to admire people who defended our (00:35:15) country. we used to admire. The sexiest (00:35:17) man I remember thinking that I looked up (00:35:19) to was my principal. He He drove a 240Z. (00:35:23) He smelled like Aqua Velva. He wore (00:35:25) these cool coats with an elbow patch. He (00:35:28) can't get laid now. Do you think a vice (00:35:30) principal has any game in any city? I (00:35:32) mean, vice principal is a good job. I (00:35:34) think some of my friends would take one. (00:35:36) Fair enough. It's so funny how so many (00:35:39) of the things you're speaking about tie (00:35:41) into all the conversations we've been (00:35:42) having on this season of the podcast. So (00:35:45) you talk about the the dismantling of a (00:35:47) community. We talked to Robert Putnham (00:35:49) and how you can directly correlate (00:35:52) communities falling apart with distrust (00:35:54) in a government and people now voting (00:35:56) against their best interests. You you (00:35:59) talk about young men feeling isolated. (00:36:01) We talked on the show about you know (00:36:03) mass shooters and like the psychology (00:36:05) behind it and like where these men are. (00:36:07) You Cristiana, funny enough, you were (00:36:09) the one who talked most about like the (00:36:10) women voting for their sons. You kept on (00:36:11) saying in the leadup to your election (00:36:13) you were like you have kids. I have (00:36:14) three kids. You have three kids. How old (00:36:15) are they? I have a 5-year-old. I have a (00:36:17) 19-month-old. And I have an eightweek (00:36:19) old. Oh, you're you're in the middle. (00:36:20) I'm in the trenches. A son and two (00:36:22) daughters. And I said, as I say on the (00:36:24) show, I want my son to turn out great. I (00:36:26) want my daughters to have great options (00:36:27) for husbands. So, I am actually (00:36:28) invested. But that's what I mean. And (00:36:30) you know what? Cristiana kept on saying (00:36:31) it. No joke. On the show, she kept on (00:36:33) saying, I'm worried, guys, that these (00:36:35) women are going to vote for their sons (00:36:37) and it's not going to And we were like, (00:36:38) what do you mean? what you but I'm I'm (00:36:39) looking at all of these things that (00:36:40) you're tying together and and maybe (00:36:42) maybe there's two aspects of it I'd love (00:36:44) to try and try and figure out with with (00:36:46) with the help of your brain. First of (00:36:49) all, I love that you talked about (00:36:53) Trump and the paradox that he contains, (00:36:56) right? In that he (00:36:59) is at the same time as being someone who (00:37:02) lies more than most human beings we've (00:37:03) ever seen. He's also strangely authentic (00:37:06) and no [ __ ] Right? It's a weird (00:37:08) paradox. Do you think America for the (00:37:11) most part has done a good job of being (00:37:14) no [ __ ] with its people and itself (00:37:16) so that people make the right decision? (00:37:18) I I'll give you an example. Let's go (00:37:19) back to Ukraine and maybe we can even (00:37:21) talk about it through the lens of co a (00:37:22) little bit. (00:37:24) I would argue most Americans when (00:37:27) they're told why America should invest (00:37:29) in Ukraine, they're told it's because of (00:37:31) morality. They're told we've got to help (00:37:34) democracy. We've got to help countries (00:37:36) stand tall. We've got to help. Why do (00:37:39) you have US aid? Because there's malaria (00:37:41) in Africa. We've got to help fight these (00:37:44) diseases. These poor Africans need our (00:37:45) help. I think it would be a lot more (00:37:48) honest and it would get to people more (00:37:50) if you said, "Hey, hey, hey, you know (00:37:53) why the things in America cost cheaper (00:37:55) than most places in the world is because (00:37:58) we have so much soft power that those (00:38:00) countries the economic argument have to (00:38:03) give it to us." So you see, if you (00:38:04) didn't live in America, this is how much (00:38:06) you would pay for this. This is how much (00:38:07) you would pay for that. This is how much (00:38:08) you would pay for that. You know, when (00:38:09) you travel and your dollar can buy you (00:38:11) anything. Yeah. It's because we have (00:38:13) this soft power. So you think we're (00:38:16) helping Ukraine for nothing. Do you know (00:38:18) who the largest exporter of grain is in (00:38:21) the world? It's Ukraine. Like, and I (00:38:24) think sometimes America like there's (00:38:25) there's been a lot of politicians who've (00:38:27) made it like this morality argument, (00:38:28) which in some ways is a little (00:38:30) duplicitous, but I also understand it (00:38:32) cuz it can come with that. the two (00:38:33) things can coexist, but they also don't (00:38:35) tell the truth. For instance, if you (00:38:36) help I I have friends who their programs (00:38:38) have been cut by us a but a lot of (00:38:40) people don't realize if you work in the (00:38:42) business of tracking disease and you (00:38:45) work in vaccines and you're around the (00:38:46) world, not only are you helping, you're (00:38:50) also doing two things. One, you're (00:38:52) presenting mass migration. Mhm. Where do (00:38:55) people migrate to when [ __ ] hits the (00:38:57) fan? They're coming here. So, it's like (00:38:59) help them in their country before they (00:39:01) come to your country. I don't see any (00:39:03) politicians on the grand scale saying (00:39:05) that. The other thing that I don't see (00:39:07) them talking enough about is how it (00:39:10) benefits America and its (00:39:12) surveillance. You get the data. People (00:39:14) forget this. When America's helping the (00:39:16) world track malaria or AIDS or whatever, (00:39:19) you're also getting data on people and (00:39:21) data is power. Data is information that (00:39:23) you can use to help your markets. Do you (00:39:25) think there's a world where that would (00:39:26) help where people get a little more (00:39:27) real? Saying to Americans, hey, (00:39:29) actually, we're not just doing this cuz (00:39:30) we're nice guys. We're doing this (00:39:31) because it makes us powerful and rich. (00:39:34) Yeah, 100%. I think so. For example, (00:39:36) think of the world as 159 NFL teams, 159 (00:39:40) countries. Imagine you were the one team (00:39:43) that got first round draft choices every (00:39:46) year. You get to pick any player in the (00:39:48) world because you're that one team. (00:39:50) Everyone wants to come play for that (00:39:52) team. That's America. We the best and (00:39:55) brightest all have one thing in common. (00:39:57) They want to come here. I mean, it's (00:39:59) just and that so that soft power, that (00:40:01) brand imagery that okay, we make (00:40:02) mistakes, but our heart's in the right (00:40:04) place, whether it's the Peace Corps or (00:40:05) US Aid or our incredible products. Trump (00:40:09) came along and basically saw an (00:40:11) opportunity where Democrats and (00:40:13) Republicans have been lying to us and (00:40:14) afraid to tell people the truth and (00:40:16) saying one thing in front of one (00:40:17) audience, saying one thing in front of (00:40:18) another, and he just came along and came (00:40:21) across as very authentic, was crude, and (00:40:23) was coarse. And we got so sick of this (00:40:25) kind of starched (00:40:28) vocabulary from our politicians and not (00:40:31) doing anything. And also corruption on (00:40:33) both sides. Speaker Emirates Pelosi has (00:40:36) been trading stocks. That's just blatant (00:40:38) corruption, right? And they would argue (00:40:40) on the right right now that this cor at (00:40:42) least, yeah, this is corruption, but (00:40:43) we're just more brazen and more uh less (00:40:46) opaque about it. You've had the same (00:40:48) corruption on the left for a long time (00:40:49) just through lobbyists and you know, how (00:40:52) does Yeah. the revolving door. Yeah. How (00:40:54) do these people get so wealthy? So, (00:40:56) look, I I always like to offer a (00:40:59) solution in terms of money in politics (00:41:01) and some of the corruption. I believe we (00:41:03) should go to a Singaporean model. I (00:41:04) think every one of our representatives (00:41:06) and senators should make one and $3 (00:41:07) million respectively. And there's (00:41:09) absolutely zero tolerance for any (00:41:12) special interest group, any speaking (00:41:13) fees, can't go to work for a lobbyist. (00:41:15) Pay them a [ __ ] ton of money because (00:41:16) after you leave office, you can't go to (00:41:18) law. 5 years Singapore model. They pay (00:41:20) them a lot of money, but they say zero (00:41:23) tolerance for corruption. You cannot you (00:41:25) cannot take campaign contributions from (00:41:27) a military-industrial complex. You (00:41:29) cannot take speaking fees. You cannot go (00:41:31) to work for Merc or Fizer the day after (00:41:33) you leave office. And they pay them a (00:41:35) lot of money because the incentives (00:41:36) right now are if you're a senator and (00:41:40) you're making what $230,000 a year. You (00:41:42) may not even be able to afford your home (00:41:43) in Los Angeles and DC. So the incentives (00:41:46) to do what everyone else is doing and (00:41:48) find different ways to take money. The (00:41:49) thing that's most disappointing about (00:41:51) Washington, as I have come into some (00:41:52) level of economic security, is not that (00:41:54) they're [ __ ] I knew that. It's what (00:41:56) cheap [ __ ] they are. How cheap are (00:41:58) they? Well, look at the Menendez story. (00:42:00) My mind, can I tell you even like I say (00:42:03) this as a South African with my South (00:42:05) African friends, we would talk about (00:42:06) this. We were shocked when we found out (00:42:09) that Senator Mendez did the thing that (00:42:12) he did for like a MercedesBenz C-Class. (00:42:16) No, no, a C-class, not an S-Class. my (00:42:18) neighbor. (00:42:20) I'm shocked at how many times America's (00:42:23) corruption or even like lobbying and (00:42:24) whatever comes up. And I can't believe (00:42:28) how cheap the price is to buy America's (00:42:31) soul from these people. It's the best (00:42:32) ROI in the world. Give a million dollars (00:42:34) to the Trump campaign. Pay pay 40 (00:42:37) million for Melania Trump's shitty (00:42:40) documentary. Fine. Fine. Right. The (00:42:43) fastest growing expense line across big (00:42:45) tech isn't R&D. It is an AI. It's (00:42:47) lobbying. If you were to give $25,000 to (00:42:50) each of the hundred senators, two and a (00:42:51) half million bucks, real money, I bet (00:42:53) every time you go to Washington, one of (00:42:56) 70 of the hundred would meet with you in (00:42:58) person. And influence is a function of (00:43:00) proximity. And it's not them, it's the (00:43:02) system they're in. The person who raises (00:43:04) the most money gets reelected. So, we've (00:43:07) created an incentive system where (00:43:09) they're basically paid to be pay for (00:43:11) play. For God's sakes, pay them a lot of (00:43:14) money. They're important. They work (00:43:15) hard. They're mostly good people, but (00:43:18) zero tolerance for corruption. Yeah. (00:43:20) Anyways, I I I think that there's just (00:43:22) no getting around it. Money has washed (00:43:24) over Washington. It's been weaponized by (00:43:27) money. And we have an incentive system (00:43:30) that is the following. More rights, more (00:43:33) democracy as you get richer. And the (00:43:35) reason the bottom 99 put up with it is (00:43:37) that America's superpower is our (00:43:39) optimism. Most kids believe and are (00:43:42) taught you're going to be in the top 1%. (00:43:44) Yeah. I can prove to every one of us (00:43:46) that 99% of our children will not be in (00:43:48) the top 1%. And so we put up with a (00:43:51) level of income inequality and rights (00:43:53) occurring to the 1% because God love us, (00:43:56) most of us believe my lottery ticket, I (00:43:58) know the lottery is dumb, but my baby, (00:44:00) my ticket's a winner, my kid is in that (00:44:02) 1%. And the whole idea of America is the (00:44:06) majority of our laws, the majority of (00:44:08) our economic programs are supposed to (00:44:10) help the bottom 50. and we've creeped (00:44:12) into the situation where it's really all (00:44:15) about the top one and then the bottom 99 (00:44:17) get 210 notifications a day that they're (00:44:19) not in the top one. I mean, just think (00:44:21) of what we're doing to the self-esteem (00:44:22) of young people who are not making as (00:44:24) much money. Rents gone up, education's (00:44:26) gone up. When I applied to UCLA, the (00:44:28) admissions rate was 76%. This year, this (00:44:30) year it's 9%. But if you don't get in, (00:44:33) you get Instagrams from your friends all (00:44:34) day showing the amazing parties they're (00:44:36) experiencing at UCLA. not only denying (00:44:40) opportunity young people, we're throwing (00:44:42) in their face all of this wealth porn (00:44:44) all day. And what do you know? We have (00:44:45) the most anxious, obese, and depressed (00:44:48) generation in history. 50% of people my (00:44:50) age feel good about America. One in 10 (00:44:52) Gen Z and millennials feel good about (00:44:54) America. Something comes off the tracks (00:44:56) with one of your kids, the whole world (00:44:58) shrinks to that kid. And I'm again going (00:45:01) to solution. Have you Have you (00:45:02) experienced that with your Oh, yeah. And (00:45:04) you will too. It just that just that's (00:45:06) what it means to have kids. The the (00:45:08) receipts for love is anxiety and grief, (00:45:11) right? That's it. You know, come on, (00:45:14) Scott. You got to give me some the good (00:45:15) there's good things coming ahead. Scared (00:45:18) me like I'm ready. I'm ready. When I was (00:45:20) Trevor, imagine a less handsome, less (00:45:22) successful guy. All I wanted was more (00:45:25) money, more experiences, more women, (00:45:26) more money, more experiences, more (00:45:28) women. But I never felt sad. I never I (00:45:31) just more [ __ ] more. The first time I (00:45:33) have felt sadated and you will feel this (00:45:35) way. There will be moments with with (00:45:36) your children where you think okay this (00:45:38) is enough. Are my children already (00:45:39) enough? This is enough. But something (00:45:41) happens to them and I mean none of this (00:45:43) other [ __ ] matters. It doesn't mean (00:45:45) anything. And for me the unifying theory (00:45:47) of everything and where I would like to (00:45:48) see every policy reverse engineer to one (00:45:51) goal and that is every person under the (00:45:53) age of 40 should have a reasonable (00:45:54) prospect of finding a mate. more third (00:45:57) spaces, mandatory national service, more (00:45:59) freshman classes, vocational (00:46:01) programming, more bars, more alcohol. (00:46:03) Quite frankly, I think young people need (00:46:05) to drink more, make a series of bad (00:46:06) decisions that might pay off. Let's (00:46:10) let's let's give young people a chance (00:46:12) to hook up remote work. No, tax (00:46:15) companies that don't have in-person work (00:46:17) fall in love. Give men a chance to (00:46:19) demonstrate excellence. He's funny. He's (00:46:21) kind. He smells nice. I will have sex (00:46:23) with him. And then you have children. (00:46:25) And every economic policy should be the (00:46:27) following. Two people who are working, (00:46:29) minimum wage, $25 an hour, universal (00:46:32) prek, get rid of long-term capital (00:46:34) gains, tax deduction, mortgage interest (00:46:36) rate. Who owns stocks and homes? Me and (00:46:38) Trevor. Who makes their money from (00:46:40) salary and pays rent? Young people. (00:46:43) Every every policy in America with this (00:46:45) prosperity should have one table stakes. (00:46:47) And that is two young people should have (00:46:49) the ability to find each other, fall in (00:46:50) love, and should they decide to have (00:46:52) kids, be able to afford it. 40 years (00:46:53) ago, 60% of 30-year-olds had at least (00:46:56) one child. Now, it's 27%. It's because (00:46:58) they don't want kids. No, it's because (00:47:00) they can't afford them. If you decide, (00:47:02) by the way, not to have kids, and you (00:47:04) want to spend all that income on brunch (00:47:05) and safe bars, more power to you. But (00:47:08) every young person should have the (00:47:09) option to find purpose in their life (00:47:12) through family. And they may decide not (00:47:13) to do it. You don't have to have kids to (00:47:15) be happy. But for God's sakes, if the (00:47:18) most prosperous nation in the world (00:47:19) can't offer people the prospect of (00:47:21) meeting, falling in love, mating, and (00:47:24) having a reasonable standard of living, (00:47:26) then none of this is working. I mean, I (00:47:28) love this. I'm a Nigerian woman. I love (00:47:30) weddings. I love I love the idea of a (00:47:34) society making people get married. I've (00:47:35) been trying to get this guy to get (00:47:36) married for years. No, no, no. You have. (00:47:38) You have. (00:47:40) Don't go anywhere cuz we got more what (00:47:42) now after (00:47:46) [Music] (00:47:50) this. You know, one of the one of the (00:47:52) first videos I saw of yours, a friend (00:47:53) sent it to me and you were talking (00:47:55) specifically about mates and mating and (00:47:57) relationships and people and you said (00:48:00) something about and I think you captured (00:48:03) a deep feeling that not many people were (00:48:04) speaking about. And funny enough, (00:48:07) Cristiana talks about it a lot. I think (00:48:08) that's why she's such a fan of yours as (00:48:09) well is the idea of the purposelessness (00:48:13) that can come with not having love or (00:48:15) not having some sort of thrust in your (00:48:17) life. And I saw this video of yours and (00:48:19) I remember thinking, man, cuz someone (00:48:21) was like, what do you think? This is (00:48:22) crazy or not? And I was like said, I (00:48:23) think this is brilliant. And also, it's (00:48:26) so easy to prove in the most extreme (00:48:29) circumstances. Go to any terror cell in (00:48:32) the world. Like I'm talking like ISIS. (00:48:35) Mhm. What are they promising them as (00:48:36) well? Why? women and girlfriends. Yeah. (00:48:39) It's crazy that even on that level in (00:48:40) the afterlife in paradise, but I'm (00:48:42) saying even even before the afterlife, (00:48:43) they're saying we're going to go there (00:48:45) and we're going to take women. We're (00:48:46) going to get wives. We're going to get (00:48:48) in some parts of the world where life is (00:48:50) a little simpler unfortunately because (00:48:52) it's harsher. You see that reality slap (00:48:55) people in the face. My life is not going (00:48:57) well. I'm joining ISIS because ISIS (00:48:59) didn't just tell me we're going to (00:49:00) fight. They said we're going to fight to (00:49:03) get a wife and a better life. Also, a (00:49:05) key ISIS pay (00:49:07) Well, they pay some people, but the (00:49:09) reason they got more at point they got (00:49:11) more recruits recruits than al-Qaeda is (00:49:12) because they paid you a bit more. Oh, (00:49:14) yeah. Well, they were smart in the (00:49:15) beginning. So, it's just like they gave (00:49:16) them jobs. Yeah. So, let's So, let's (00:49:17) talk about the Let's talk about the man (00:49:19) side of this whole thing because I love (00:49:21) that you talk about it, the manosphere (00:49:22) and the (00:49:24) Before we even get into that, I'd love (00:49:26) to know what do you think it is about (00:49:28) you that has connected with a group that (00:49:32) people would have argued wouldn't have (00:49:33) connected with your views maybe like two (00:49:35) years ago? Cuz if you if you wrote down (00:49:37) on paper, Scott Galloway, this is what (00:49:39) he believes in. He believes in basic (00:49:41) incomes being this. He believes in (00:49:42) healthcare. He believes in pre-K. He (00:49:44) believes in if somebody had drawn that (00:49:46) up and then somebody had put the crypto (00:49:50) bros and the whatever we want to call (00:49:51) people if we're putting them in a box, (00:49:53) they would have said, "Oh, this person (00:49:54) will never agree with that person." And (00:49:56) yet you've made massive inroads with a (00:49:58) lot of these young men who people have (00:50:01) said wouldn't agree with their views. So (00:50:02) some young women I'm a fan. Oh, no. No. (00:50:04) Yeah. But I'm saying the men but I'm (00:50:06) saying the men in particular where (00:50:08) they've where people have just said no (00:50:09) you know so what do you think it is that (00:50:12) you are saying or what do you think it (00:50:13) is that you are doing that is connecting (00:50:15) you to them and what are other people (00:50:17) missing about connecting to them well (00:50:19) first of thank you your comments are (00:50:21) generous like I I started talking about (00:50:23) struggling young men five years ago and (00:50:26) real insight is when you state something (00:50:27) that's obvious but people weren't (00:50:29) thinking about and the data is just (00:50:31) overwhelming and that is no group has (00:50:32) ascended faster (00:50:34) globally than women. And by the way, we (00:50:36) should get do nothing to get in the way (00:50:38) of this. Women are more women are (00:50:39) seeking tertiary education now globally (00:50:42) than men. The number of women elected to (00:50:44) parliament in a democracy has doubled in (00:50:46) the last 30 years. In the United States, (00:50:48) women in urban metros under the age of (00:50:50) 30 are making more money than men. More (00:50:53) single women own homes than men. Two in (00:50:55) three women under the age of 30 are in a (00:50:58) relationship. Only one in three men. And (00:50:59) you think, well, that's mathematically (00:51:00) impossible. It's not because women are (00:51:03) dating older because they want more e (00:51:04) economically and emotionally viable men. (00:51:07) What you have in the US is no group has (00:51:10) fallen further faster than young men. (00:51:12) And it's for a variety of reasons. (00:51:14) Biologically, their their prefrontal (00:51:15) cortex is 18 months behind a woman. It (00:51:18) doesn't catch up till 25. They just lack (00:51:20) the executive function in the judgment. (00:51:22) A big part is male abandonment. Uh a lot (00:51:25) of young men don't have the male (00:51:27) involvement in their lives. That is key. (00:51:29) And even if you were to say that 5 years (00:51:31) ago, the gag reflex was, well, what are (00:51:34) you saying? Mothers can't raise sons? (00:51:35) No, I'm not saying that at all. But the (00:51:37) research is pretty striking. When (00:51:39) there's a single parent household, and (00:51:40) let's be honest, 92% of the time it's (00:51:42) the woman heading the household in a (00:51:44) single parent home as mine was, the girl (00:51:47) in the household has the same outcomes. (00:51:49) Same rate of college attendance, same (00:51:51) rates of self harm. In some, she's okay. (00:51:54) The boy, the moment he loses a male role (00:51:56) model, becomes much more likely to kill (00:51:58) himself. much more likely to be (00:51:59) incarcerated. What it ends up, if you (00:52:01) look at the data, is that while boys are (00:52:04) physically stronger, they're emotionally (00:52:06) and mentally much weaker. And we don't (00:52:09) even want to acknowledge at one point (00:52:11) four or five years ago, you could get (00:52:12) into trouble by even claiming there was (00:52:14) a difference amongst genders and young (00:52:17) people. And if you were advocating for (00:52:19) men, you were seen as a misogynist (00:52:21) because so many unproductive voices (00:52:23) filled this void with [ __ ] thinly (00:52:26) veiled misogyny. And what we have come (00:52:29) to realize, and the dialogue has gotten (00:52:30) a lot better, and it's mostly been led (00:52:32) by mothers, is that empathy is not a (00:52:34) zero- sum game. We can still acknowledge (00:52:36) the immense challenges women face. The (00:52:39) moment you had kids, your average salary (00:52:41) went to 73 cents on the dollar. (00:52:43) Corporate America has still not figured (00:52:45) out a way to maintain a woman's (00:52:47) professional trajectory when she decides (00:52:49) to use her ovaries. At the same time, (00:52:52) young men, if you go into a morg in the (00:52:54) United States and there's five people (00:52:55) who've died by suicide, four are men. If (00:52:59) any other special interest group was (00:53:01) killing themselves at four times the (00:53:02) rate of the control group, we'd weigh in (00:53:04) with programs. And finally, we're (00:53:07) starting to acknowledge that women (00:53:08) cannot continue to flourish and our (00:53:10) country cannot continue to flourish if (00:53:12) young men are floundering. But Scott, (00:53:15) don't you think it's points to the fact (00:53:16) that a lot of men don't care about men? (00:53:18) Because I think about the women in my (00:53:20) life, not just mothers, sisters, (00:53:24) friends, we spend a lot of time worrying (00:53:27) about the men and boys in our life. (00:53:29) Whether it's give the example of a (00:53:32) single mother is just with her son. Now, (00:53:35) if a mother is absent from a friend's (00:53:38) life, other women will step in and fill (00:53:40) that woman's role. Why aren't men (00:53:43) saying, "Well, there's a single mother (00:53:45) down the street or I have a family (00:53:46) member that's single." Why aren't men (00:53:48) stepping in? Why don't men care about (00:53:49) men and boys? It's a great point. If you (00:53:51) were to reverse engineer when a boy (00:53:53) comes off the tracks and becomes an (00:53:55) unproductive man, it's the single point (00:53:58) of failure is when he loses a male role (00:54:00) model. We have the second most single (00:54:02) parent homes in the world behind Sweden. (00:54:04) And unfortunately, there's a taboo. If (00:54:08) you were to get involved in a (00:54:09) 15-year-old's life, if you were to look (00:54:11) around the office and say, "Single (00:54:12) mother, say, "I'm Trevor. I'm going to a (00:54:14) game. Do you have a son who'd like to (00:54:15) hang out with me?" (00:54:17) because you're immediately suspected. (00:54:20) You're you're immediately quite frankly (00:54:22) Michael Jackson and the Catholic Church (00:54:23) have [ __ ] it up for all of us. And (00:54:25) that is if a man wants to be involved in (00:54:26) a boy's life, there's a bit of (00:54:28) trepidation. Is there something wrong (00:54:30) with him? Is he up to something really (00:54:33) macious or awful? Could he be possibly a (00:54:35) pedophile? And this is such a tragedy (00:54:38) because there are so many men with (00:54:40) fraternal and fraternal love to give (00:54:42) that maybe don't have kids of their own (00:54:44) or maybe just are concerned or see the (00:54:46) problem who are willing to weigh in and (00:54:48) they're kind of told by society not to. (00:54:50) And also quite frankly men are not (00:54:51) stepping up. There are three times as (00:54:53) many women applying to be big sisters in (00:54:55) the New York Big Sisters program as (00:54:57) there are men applying to be big (00:54:59) brothers. In some if we want better men, (00:55:02) we have to be better men. And you're (00:55:04) exactly right. Men need to there needs (00:55:06) to be a zeicist in our society. Family (00:55:08) court, neighbors. The moment a boy no (00:55:12) longer has a male role model in his (00:55:14) life, other men need to step into the (00:55:15) void. My mom was really good at this. (00:55:17) She made sure I'm still in contact with (00:55:19) a couple of her ex-boyfriends. There was (00:55:21) a neighbor across the hall who used to (00:55:23) come over with his girlfriend and take (00:55:24) me horseback riding. I had men in my (00:55:27) life and sometimes there are millions of (00:55:29) young men right now, boys. the first (00:55:31) male role model they have is a prison (00:55:33) guard because men aren't stepping up. (00:55:35) And I think of I'm writing a book on (00:55:36) masculinity. I think of concentric (00:55:38) circles of masculinity. You take care of (00:55:41) yourself. You're strong. You're (00:55:42) economically viable. You're kind. You're (00:55:45) a you're a you're a [ __ ] monster. You (00:55:47) have this unbelievable thing called (00:55:49) superior bone structure, risk (00:55:52) aggressiveness, this amazing substance (00:55:54) called testosterone. You protect others. (00:55:56) You take care of yourself. Second circle (00:55:58) out. you protect your family, you're a (00:56:00) good provider. Next circle out, you take (00:56:02) care of your community and your (00:56:03) neighbors and you help other people. The (00:56:05) ultimate expression of masculinity in my (00:56:07) view is to take an irrational interest (00:56:09) in the well-being of a child that's not (00:56:11) yours. And not enough men are doing this (00:56:14) and it is so easy to find them. Can I (00:56:17) tell you an idea I have? I wish more men (00:56:21) made men who are bad fathers a pariah. (00:56:24) Like if you have a friend that doesn't (00:56:26) see his kid, he shouldn't be a friend. (00:56:29) So can I can I say two things to this? (00:56:32) Right. (00:56:33) I agree with the premise completely. (00:56:35) Mhm. But I think it is important just as (00:56:39) you do on on all issues. I think it's (00:56:42) it's important to consider what the (00:56:43) possible reasons can be. Okay. So on on (00:56:46) the one hand to what you're saying, I (00:56:49) don't think like most men would not want (00:56:52) to step in, etc. I I don't think so (00:56:55) honestly but I do know from speaking to (00:56:59) men everywhere around the world (00:57:02) to what you're saying about like wealth (00:57:04) porn etc man men maybe because they (00:57:07) imagine it or maybe because they're (00:57:09) experiencing it a lot of men just feel (00:57:11) like they've got to like double grind to (00:57:14) even get the basic that first concentric (00:57:16) circle to what you're saying has been (00:57:17) crushed right and and we've got to (00:57:19) consider all the ways it's been crushed. (00:57:21) How have like the junk food companies (00:57:23) crushed people's abilities to even like (00:57:25) eat what they eat and stay healthy? You (00:57:27) start with people's food, what they get (00:57:28) access to. You start with, as you say, (00:57:30) opportunities, income, being kicked out (00:57:32) of school, etc., etc., etc. And I think (00:57:34) you you've also got to consider what (00:57:36) it's like to be a young man where the (00:57:39) dreams that you are sold and told don't (00:57:41) come true because the system hasn't been (00:57:44) set up, as you said, correctly. Right. (00:57:46) So I think I think I I honestly believe (00:57:48) that I think I feel a lot of compassion (00:57:49) for I think any failed promise whoever (00:57:52) it's made to I feel a lot of compassion (00:57:54) for those people. No. So I'm just saying (00:57:56) in understanding that is like I go like (00:57:57) for me as Trevor for instance I have (00:57:59) more time and I do make the time to be (00:58:01) with friends or extended people's (00:58:04) younger kids because they know me so (00:58:06) they can trust me right but it's like (00:58:07) all right take him go-karting take that (00:58:10) one there do that thing there do but I (00:58:12) have the disposable income and I have (00:58:14) the time income as well to be like yeah (00:58:16) I can do that and I will do that and I (00:58:18) you know what I mean but I've seen for a (00:58:20) lot of people they go like hey man I (00:58:21) can't even get my [ __ ] together who am I (00:58:24) to you I think that's the first one. The (00:58:26) second one to what you you were saying. (00:58:28) You said that the the the you said the (00:58:29) thing that you were you the proposal you (00:58:31) had was I think that um you should (00:58:33) become a social pariah if you don't look (00:58:35) after kids. No, cuz I and I'll say this (00:58:37) and and I've seen it in my community a (00:58:39) lot. There are dead beats and there is (00:58:42) no consequence. Their friends still roll (00:58:44) with them. Their mothers still let them (00:58:45) in their house and they do not show up (00:58:47) for their kids. And if a woman does not (00:58:50) look after her child, if a woman even (00:58:52) comes back to work early, I've had (00:58:53) people DM me like, "You had a baby 8 (00:58:55) weeks ago. Who's with the baby?" Right? (00:58:57) Like, and I'm ostensibly think I'm doing (00:58:59) a good thing. Do you know what I mean? (00:59:01) And a woman who is not seen as a perfect (00:59:04) mother is judged and vilified. Absent (00:59:07) fathers, there is no social consequence. (00:59:10) So, I'm think saying there should be a (00:59:11) social consequence for not showing up (00:59:13) for your son. So, now this is I agree (00:59:14) with you 100% on this. And because of (00:59:17) that, I would like I was so fervently in (00:59:20) that mode that I would like fight with (00:59:22) people on this. And then I came to (00:59:23) realize something that maybe in this (00:59:25) world we aren't addressing in the same (00:59:27) way. There are many, many, many men who (00:59:30) feel like they've been made a deadbeat (00:59:33) dad. Do you get what I'm saying? There (00:59:34) are many many many men who feel like (00:59:36) they go yo this and I this is me now (00:59:39) anecdotally only anecdotally I know some (00:59:42) men personally who were good men wanted (00:59:45) to be with their kids you name it and (00:59:47) the woman in their life was like you see (00:59:49) we broke up I'm going to make sure you (00:59:51) never see these kids ever again and they (00:59:54) and and I'm not saying this is all of (00:59:56) them so I'm not absolving the inverse I (00:59:58) think and it's it's it's evolutionary (01:00:00) biology they say that um what is what's (01:00:03) the saying that it's a mother's, baby, (01:00:05) father's. Maybe a man is more likely to (01:00:08) treat his si his sister's child with (01:00:12) more love than he is his mate's child or (01:00:15) his wife. They've done studies on this (01:00:17) because you know your sister's child is (01:00:19) related to you. All that to say, I (01:00:21) believe a man's relationship with his (01:00:22) children, I don't I I know this not (01:00:24) going to be a popular thing to say, is (01:00:26) often connected to how he feels about (01:00:27) the children's mother. Yes. No, but I (01:00:29) agree with that. So, for the most part, (01:00:30) it's men being like, "I split up with (01:00:32) you. I see you less. He gets a second (01:00:34) wife and he's a really good dad to those (01:00:36) second set of kids. I see that all the (01:00:38) time. Less so do I see women and I'm not (01:00:40) saying that these villainous women don't (01:00:42) exist who say you can't see your kid. I (01:00:44) think that's a cultural trope we've laid (01:00:45) out. No, no, I was just saying what wait (01:00:46) I was just saying one. Please please let (01:00:48) me let me explain. I was giving you one (01:00:50) one that I know anecdotally. I'm not (01:00:52) saying all of them. There's another one. (01:00:54) And this is again the system that we've (01:00:56) created (01:00:57) in America in particular and in many (01:00:59) other countries. you get divorced, you (01:01:01) get broken up with whatever. Most of the (01:01:03) time the system says the mother keeps (01:01:05) the child, the man has to pay for the (01:01:07) child to be with the mother. And that (01:01:09) money is calculated strangely in some (01:01:11) place. Some places some people say it's (01:01:12) very fair, some people say it's unfair, (01:01:14) but it's strangely calculated. And now (01:01:16) to what Scott was just saying, we live (01:01:18) in a world where people already cannot (01:01:20) afford the one house that they were (01:01:21) promised, you know, in the American (01:01:23) dream. 40 years ago, people could buy (01:01:26) that house even on a mega salary. You (01:01:27) know, you someone was putting out the (01:01:29) numbers recently and they showed that (01:01:31) like 40 years ago in somewhere like (01:01:32) Philadelphia, you could buy a house, you (01:01:35) could put down the down payment for a (01:01:36) house with like a month's salary. (01:01:38) There's no way you can do that now in (01:01:39) that same Philadelphia even because (01:01:41) houses have gone up way way way faster (01:01:43) than salaries have gone up, right? So, (01:01:46) so from that perspective alone, I think (01:01:48) it is important to look at a place like (01:01:49) Sweden. I remember going to Sweden and (01:01:51) talking to it was like basically they (01:01:53) had like Dr. Fouchy and I was asking him (01:01:55) about like why Sweden has so many one (01:01:58) parent household households but so so (01:02:01) few of the problems and he said yes but (01:02:03) you're forgetting one thing and that is (01:02:05) here in Sweden first of all you are not (01:02:07) a pariah if you are single right that's (01:02:10) the first thing and secondly you're (01:02:12) protected by the states it makes a big (01:02:14) difference when your relationship with (01:02:17) the other person is not determined by (01:02:20) your money just think we're making a lot (01:02:22) of excuses for men because mothers can't (01:02:24) the same thing. No, but I'm saying why. (01:02:25) I'm not saying it's an excuse. You see, (01:02:26) there's a difference between an excuse (01:02:28) and an answer. I think an excuse is (01:02:30) saying you've done it, but there was (01:02:31) nothing we could have done, and you're (01:02:32) not wrong. I'm not saying you're wrong (01:02:34) or right. I'm just saying like what is (01:02:35) the answer for this thing? And I think (01:02:38) sometimes when we look at the social (01:02:40) economic impacts of how in America (01:02:44) specifically, how it sets it up, when (01:02:46) you are a dad that leaves the house, for (01:02:48) many men, it is difficult to continue (01:02:50) being the dad the way you want to be. (01:02:52) Now, how they deal with it is shitty. (01:02:54) And also, credit to women. I was also (01:02:56) raised by a single mother and I've seen (01:02:57) it. And in our programs in Africa, we (01:03:00) still do the same thing. We know you (01:03:01) give the money to women cuz women know (01:03:03) how to make that dollar go further. I (01:03:04) think you're both right. One in six men (01:03:06) 3 years post divorce have no contact (01:03:08) with their children. Wow. Some of that (01:03:10) is male abandonment. Some of it is just (01:03:12) a total lack of character. You don't (01:03:14) hear a lot about female abandonment (01:03:16) because it just doesn't happen that (01:03:17) much. At the same time, family court is (01:03:20) also, you would argue, bias against men. (01:03:21) Sometimes it literally impoverishes them (01:03:24) sometimes. Also, the reality is in (01:03:27) divorce, there's a lot of emotion and my (01:03:29) parents weaponized it and tried to (01:03:31) convince me to hate the other. And (01:03:32) you're just more inclined to believe the (01:03:34) person you're living with, that the (01:03:36) other person is bad. So, I think that we (01:03:38) need to change and say, okay, regardless (01:03:40) of how you feel about each other, you (01:03:42) need to be supportive of each other for (01:03:44) the kid's sake post divorce. It's a (01:03:46) nuanced argument with a lot of factors, (01:03:49) but in general, there needs to be a (01:03:51) zeitgeist in our society that the moment (01:03:54) a boy loses a male role model, the (01:03:57) community has to rally around that kid, (01:03:59) the mother, the brothers, the uncles, (01:04:02) and the men to say, we have to get men (01:04:07) involved in his life. Yeah. And that's (01:04:09) not happening. It's not, you know, these (01:04:12) uh think about it, after school (01:04:14) programs, not as many coaches anymore, (01:04:16) right? Yeah. They're not going into (01:04:18) work. I My first job was at Morgan (01:04:20) Stanley. I got a lot of male mentorship. (01:04:22) I was in a fraternity. I remember my (01:04:24) quote unquote big brother in the (01:04:25) fraternity sitting me down my freshman (01:04:26) year and saying, "You need to stop (01:04:27) getting high every night." And I needed (01:04:29) a 22-year-old male that I could look up (01:04:31) to. I didn't have a lot of male (01:04:33) involvement in my life to tell me that. (01:04:34) My first boss, you know, was a great (01:04:37) guardrail for me. Young men need guard (01:04:40) rails more than young women, quite (01:04:41) frankly, where young women get them. (01:04:42) When a young woman isn't in a (01:04:44) relationship, she reinvests oftentimes a (01:04:46) lot of that energy into her friend (01:04:47) network, into her professional life. (01:04:49) When a man's not in a relationship, he (01:04:51) oftenimes reinvests it in video games (01:04:53) and porn and he sequesters from society. (01:04:57) And a tremendous guard rail for young (01:04:59) men that they're not getting is a (01:05:00) relationship. Okay, Scott, I think a (01:05:03) relationship is one thing. Mhm. Um, my (01:05:06) husband, interesting enough, was raised (01:05:07) by a single mother, but had great male (01:05:09) role models in his grandfather and his (01:05:11) uncle. So, I'm actually get concerned (01:05:13) about how little trauma he has. That's (01:05:16) my worry with him. Um, but he has this (01:05:18) incredible group of male friends. Like, (01:05:21) they're like really tight and they've (01:05:22) all become dads at the same time and (01:05:24) they take their kids out together. And (01:05:26) I'm really struck by how much he invests (01:05:29) time in his friendship. And even in that (01:05:31) group of men, there's about seven to (01:05:32) eight of them. A couple of them aren't (01:05:34) married yet, but they're still involved. (01:05:35) So, if there's a birthday, they'll fly (01:05:37) in, etc., etc. I kind of rub up against (01:05:40) the idea that having a mate is the only (01:05:43) arena these men can find care because I (01:05:45) see a lot of women marry men and they're (01:05:47) like, "Now I have someone to babysit." (01:05:50) Isn't there a way that we can encourage (01:05:52) young men to invest in their friendships (01:05:54) and in a brotherhood and in their (01:05:56) communities in a way that means even if (01:05:58) you don't have a romantic relationship, (01:06:00) you still have a really rich and (01:06:01) fulfilled life. Because I just this (01:06:03) world where my daughters are going to (01:06:04) grow up and okay, the man does have a (01:06:07) job or whatever, but she's going to have (01:06:08) to look after him all the time and if (01:06:10) she doesn't, he falls off the rails. I'd (01:06:12) rather like it be a man who has a really (01:06:13) rich interior life and social network (01:06:16) and if he's married or not or if he has (01:06:17) a girlfriend or not, it doesn't matter. (01:06:19) It's not as socially devastating. I (01:06:21) think you're talking about the way the (01:06:22) world should be, not the way it is. He (01:06:24) can perhaps make it. Well, that's that's (01:06:27) very nice. So, the reality I'm not an (01:06:30) optimist. I'm just saying that we have a (01:06:32) have that in common. A 30 a 30-y old Oh, (01:06:34) I see why you guys why you're a friend. (01:06:36) 30-year-old A 30-year-old male that (01:06:38) hasn't lived with a woman or been (01:06:39) married has a one in three chance of (01:06:41) becoming a substance abuser. And a (01:06:44) strong friend network is incredibly (01:06:46) important. But without a romantic (01:06:50) relationship, men have a tendency to not (01:06:53) reinvest in their social network and (01:06:55) their professional lives the way that (01:06:56) women do. You clearly have figured out (01:06:59) that male friendship is really important (01:07:02) for men. They open up to other men. They (01:07:04) can express. The people who have the (01:07:06) most job prospects are the most social. (01:07:09) They have an outlet with each other. Do (01:07:11) you think in general though that women (01:07:13) once they get married are really (01:07:15) supportive of men spending more time (01:07:16) with their friends? I think I think it (01:07:18) depends on the friends. I like my (01:07:19) husband's friends. Okay. Most women see (01:07:23) a guy spending more time with their (01:07:25) mates as a threat to the relationship. (01:07:28) In addition, corporations don't want men (01:07:31) spending a lot of time with their (01:07:32) friends. They want them making more (01:07:33) money. This is the difference. I don't (01:07:34) really like men. There's a boys club and (01:07:36) they leave me alone. It's a dream. But (01:07:38) the larger point you bring up is the (01:07:40) following. One in seven men in America (01:07:42) doesn't have a single friend. One in (01:07:43) four men can't name a best friend. Damn, (01:07:46) that's crazy. And we have what I would (01:07:48) argue is a loneliness crisis. And the (01:07:50) most frightening thing for young men (01:07:51) right now in my view is that the deepest (01:07:53) pocketed, most talented companies in the (01:07:55) world are trying to convince young men (01:07:57) especially that they can have a (01:07:59) reasonable faximile of life on a screen (01:08:01) with an algorithm. Why go through the (01:08:03) effort of trying to have friends and (01:08:04) figuring out the pecking order and your (01:08:05) social currency when you can go on (01:08:07) Reddit and Discord? And why, for God's (01:08:09) sakes, would you ever go through the (01:08:11) humiliation, the rejection, working out, (01:08:13) having a plan, being funny, smelling (01:08:15) nice, enduring rejection, feeling (01:08:18) humiliated, figuring out a way to feel (01:08:21) confident, showing the perseverance such (01:08:23) that you can establish a romantic or a (01:08:25) sexual relationship when you have porn. (01:08:28) So what we have is a I think (01:08:30) unfortunately we're evolving a new (01:08:33) species of asexual asocial males and (01:08:36) they're the most dangerous people in the (01:08:38) world. Very dangerous because and I (01:08:40) don't want to pathize them. We have a (01:08:42) tendency to say, "Oh, they're the school (01:08:43) shooters." Actually, the people they're (01:08:44) most dangerous towards is themselves. (01:08:47) They're much more likely to harm (01:08:48) themselves and harm other people. But (01:08:50) the one thing the most unstable, violent (01:08:52) societies have in common is a (01:08:54) disproportionate amount of young men who (01:08:56) have no economic or romantic prospects. (01:08:59) So, and we don't like to have an ominous (01:09:01) conversation around mating. The reality (01:09:03) is women mate socioeconomically (01:09:05) horizontally and up, men horizontally (01:09:07) and down. And when dating apps are now (01:09:09) where 50 to 60% of all relationships (01:09:12) begin, the reductive analysis is the (01:09:14) following. Can you signal resources and (01:09:16) are you tall? Men have very few arenas (01:09:19) to demonstrate excellence anymore. If (01:09:22) you talk to people who've been married (01:09:23) longer than 30 years, 80% of them say (01:09:26) one was much more interested in the (01:09:27) other. And it was almost always the man (01:09:29) was much more interested. But when (01:09:31) there's no places when men aren't going (01:09:33) into work, when men don't have third (01:09:34) spaces, when they're not serving in the (01:09:35) military together, they have no place to (01:09:38) demonstrate kindness. He was funny. I (01:09:40) liked his hands. He was great at what he (01:09:43) did. And so as a result, we have this (01:09:45) dating environment where the top 10% get (01:09:49) literally all of the interest and the (01:09:51) bottom 90% are just shut out. And then (01:09:53) they become very prone to really ugly (01:09:56) voices that say it's a woman's fault. (01:09:58) They're much more prone to misogynistic (01:09:59) content. They're much more prone to (01:10:01) nationalist content. So figuring out (01:10:04) environments where more people can meet (01:10:06) and more men quite frankly can (01:10:08) demonstrate excellence such they can get (01:10:10) through the finer filter of of mating (01:10:12) that women have. The greatest innovation (01:10:14) in history, it's not the iPhone or the (01:10:16) semiconductor. It's the American middle (01:10:18) class. And fundamental to that (01:10:20) innovation was that 7 million men (01:10:22) returned from World War II. They had (01:10:23) demonstrated excellence in uniform. We (01:10:25) gave them enough money so they could (01:10:27) afford a home. We gave them jobs and (01:10:29) they became very attractive to a lot of (01:10:31) women. And we started the baby boom and (01:10:33) we had such wonderful prosperity that (01:10:35) American liberal households said, "Let's (01:10:37) bring women into this prosperity." I (01:10:39) know. Let's bring let's bring non-whites (01:10:41) into this prosperity. And we got along (01:10:43) because the majority of our leaders had (01:10:45) served in the same uniform so they saw (01:10:46) themselves as Americans before they saw (01:10:48) themselves as Republicans or Democrats. (01:10:51) But unless we figure out a way to level (01:10:52) up young people and find a place where (01:10:54) they can meet and fall in love and mate (01:10:56) and they have the economic wherewithal (01:10:57) to do it, we're just going to continue (01:10:59) to generate the most dangerous person in (01:11:01) the world, and that is a young man with (01:11:03) no economic or romantic prospects. I (01:11:06) coach a lot of young men, and one of the (01:11:07) first things I talk about is they really (01:11:09) want a girlfriend. And I the first (01:11:11) question I ask is, would you have sex (01:11:12) with you? Would you have sex with you? (01:11:16) Do you have a plan? You don't need to be (01:11:18) a baller. You don't need to be a rich, (01:11:19) but do you have a plan? Are you going to (01:11:21) vocational school? Are you thinking (01:11:22) about driving an Uber and saving up so (01:11:24) you can get a second car to have a (01:11:25) second Uber? Do you shower? Do you have (01:11:28) good grooming? Are you funny? Are you (01:11:30) willing to endure rejection? Are you (01:11:31) willing to try really hard? You know, (01:11:34) would you have sex with you? And there (01:11:36) aren't enough men. How many times have (01:11:37) we heard, "I've got all these great (01:11:40) women in my life. They're so attractive. (01:11:41) They're so [ __ ] together, but they can't (01:11:42) find a man." No, they just can't find a (01:11:44) man they want to mate with. And women (01:11:47) are getting taller every year. They're (01:11:49) becoming more economically viable. It's (01:11:50) leading to a lot more divorce because (01:11:52) quite frankly, men are not ascending in (01:11:54) terms of picking up some of the slack (01:11:55) logistically. So, it's like, okay, (01:11:57) you're no longer a provider. And by the (01:11:59) way, it's not like you're really picking (01:12:00) up the slack at home. So, women are (01:12:02) saying you're out. So, for a lot of (01:12:05) reasons, I think we have to figure out a (01:12:07) way to have honest conversations with (01:12:08) men around, okay, this is what women are (01:12:10) attracted to. Signaling resources. (01:12:13) That's the hard truth. You need an (01:12:14) economic plan. Two, intellect. Are you (01:12:17) interesting? Are you funny? Do you do (01:12:20) you have interest in current events? And (01:12:22) then the third thing, the secret weapon (01:12:24) for men in mating that we don't talk a (01:12:25) lot about is kindness. Women actually (01:12:27) want someone who's going to be kind (01:12:29) because it means you're more likely to (01:12:30) be good to her parents and good to your (01:12:32) kids. Where do young people find mates (01:12:35) in America right now? So, when I think (01:12:38) about every aspect of this problem, I (01:12:42) think about where some of that potential (01:12:44) is being leeched out. I love video games (01:12:47) with all my heart. What I hate now is (01:12:50) video games have been made perpetual. So (01:12:53) when you start when I started playing (01:12:54) video games, they (01:12:56) ended was great. You played a game and (01:12:58) it ended. Game over. You know what I (01:13:01) mean? You finished Mario Brothers and (01:13:02) that was it. And games evolved and you (01:13:04) played whatever it was, you know, Duke (01:13:05) Nukem, you name it. You name it. You you (01:13:07) could finish the games don't finish now. (01:13:09) And so like in a weird way, the first (01:13:11) thing I think of is what you're saying (01:13:12) is you cannot meet these people and you (01:13:14) cannot go on to do these things if (01:13:16) you're perpetually stuck in a game (01:13:18) that's been designed, by the way. It's (01:13:20) been designed to keep you there, to keep (01:13:22) you spinning, to keep you going. You you (01:13:25) also aren't going to think of being kind (01:13:28) or funny when you're not around other (01:13:29) people. We we've shown time and time (01:13:31) again being with people makes you like (01:13:33) those people, as in like it makes you be (01:13:35) more like them. But if we don't have (01:13:37) third spaces where people can go without (01:13:39) money for instance, how do we get that? (01:13:42) Like where where you going? I even ask (01:13:44) people this all the time in New York and (01:13:45) Manhattan anyway. I go, where can you go (01:13:47) without money? Honestly, yes, you can go (01:13:48) to a park, but beyond that, like in the (01:13:51) in the doldrums of winter in New York, (01:13:53) where can you go? You're from London. (01:13:55) 40% of nightclubs in London have closed (01:13:58) down since co I know. I know. Young (01:14:00) people don't have money and they're also (01:14:02) drinking less. But you were talking (01:14:05) about kind of I I think our economy has (01:14:07) moved from an attention economy to (01:14:09) unfortunately in an addiction economy (01:14:10) and I think it's especially hard on (01:14:11) young men who are more prone to (01:14:12) addiction because they're more risk (01:14:14) aggressive. I think basically our (01:14:15) economy now the kind of axis of evil is (01:14:18) get people addicted to shitty food to (01:14:19) gambling to porn and then hand them over (01:14:22) to the addiction industrial complex. The (01:14:24) most valuable company in Europe now is a (01:14:25) GLP-p1 producer, right? And then if you (01:14:28) think about young men, they're much more (01:14:30) prone to addiction and especially (01:14:32) gambling addictions. Six and seven (01:14:33) gambling addicts are boys. 50% of (01:14:36) college age men bet on the Super Bowl. (01:14:39) And the in net income of Las Vegas is (01:14:41) down 40% this year because everyone now (01:14:43) has a casino in their pocket. Yeah. And (01:14:46) the crazy thing about gambling addiction (01:14:48) is that the addiction with the highest (01:14:50) suicide rate is gambling. Because if you (01:14:52) had a meth addiction, we would know it (01:14:54) and someone would weigh in who cared (01:14:56) about you. You can get out so far in (01:14:59) front of your SKS with a gambling (01:15:00) addiction and no one knows. Yeah, we (01:15:01) talked about that on the podcast with (01:15:03) Ka, my friend. His younger brother (01:15:05) committed suicide because he was deep in (01:15:07) gambling debt. No one knew until it was (01:15:09) too late. Things spins and now this was (01:15:12) even pre the apps in that way. And now (01:15:15) it feels like I mean the apps run every (01:15:18) sport now. the the NBA, the NFL, they (01:15:21) they're almost sanctioned by the leagues (01:15:23) now. They're the official betting (01:15:25) partner of Do you know what I mean? (01:15:26) Yeah. So, let me ask you this then, (01:15:28) Scott. Like, (01:15:30) I like that you said, you love offering (01:15:32) solutions. (01:15:35) Let's try think of a solution for the (01:15:37) individual and and a solution for the (01:15:39) community. You know, as as Cristiana (01:15:41) eloquently put, I think even when we're (01:15:43) talking about race, it's important to (01:15:46) think of who's most affected. And (01:15:47) ironically, when men are disaffected, (01:15:49) women become the most affected. You see (01:15:51) it in like the rates of violence that (01:15:53) women will experience. They become these (01:15:55) dangerous men. Yeah. You know. Yeah. No, (01:15:57) definitely. So, let's talk about it on (01:16:00) the on the individual side. There's a (01:16:03) young man who's watching this right now (01:16:04) and they go, "Scott, I don't have (01:16:07) connections. I don't see hope. I don't (01:16:10) see anything. I'm watching this video on (01:16:12) YouTube right now on my phone or on Tik (01:16:15) Tok or wherever wherever I am. What are (01:16:18) like three steps I can take that just (01:16:19) get me on the path to moving forward to (01:16:22) purpose, kindness, and a space where I (01:16:25) can show my brilliance. I love that. So, (01:16:27) I try to walk the walk. I try and coach (01:16:29) two young men at a time. And the people (01:16:31) I coach, quite (01:16:32) frankly, are struggling. You know, I get (01:16:35) a lot of people who send me emails and (01:16:37) say, "Will you be my mentor?" And I (01:16:39) talked to him like, "You don't dude, you (01:16:41) could mentor me." You know, I talked to (01:16:42) some 24 year old working at Google. He's (01:16:44) like, "I need a mentor." I'm like, (01:16:45) "You're just (01:16:46) fine." What the first thing I do, I try (01:16:48) and do it in person. Um, but oftentimes (01:16:51) it's over Zoom. The first thing I do is (01:16:53) the following. I say, "Open your unlock (01:16:55) your screen. I want to see your app (01:16:57) time." And the first thing I do to put (01:16:58) them at ease is I say to them, I gamble. (01:17:00) I buy options. I'm not immune from (01:17:02) gambling. I like porn. I try to modulate (01:17:05) my use, but I like porn because I want (01:17:06) to put them at ease. I'm not going to (01:17:08) judge them. And I say, okay, everyone (01:17:10) has an advantage. You want to lean into (01:17:11) your advantage. Your advantage as a (01:17:12) young person is you have a lot of (01:17:14) capital, but you have human capital. You (01:17:15) have more time than money. But that's an (01:17:17) advantage. We're going to find 8 to 12 (01:17:19) hours of human capital of time in your (01:17:21) phone. And it's so easy. Between Tik (01:17:24) Tok, between X, between Coinbase, (01:17:27) between Upuporn, in about 3 minutes, I (01:17:30) can get them agreed to find 8 to 12 (01:17:32) hours a week of human capital. I'm like, (01:17:35) "All right, next week we're going to (01:17:36) open your phone and you're going to show (01:17:37) me that you took 8 to 12 hours of human (01:17:40) capital out of your phone and we're (01:17:42) going to reallocate that precious human (01:17:44) capital into three areas. (01:17:47) One, you're going to start getting fit. (01:17:50) You need to be strong. If you're under (01:17:52) the age of 30 and you're man, you're (01:17:53) blessed with an unbelievable physiology. (01:17:55) Any man under the age of 30 should be (01:17:57) able to walk into any room and know if (01:17:58) [ __ ] got real, they could either kill (01:17:59) and eat everybody or outrun them. You'll (01:18:02) be kinder. You'll feel better about (01:18:04) yourself. Who breaks up fights at bars? (01:18:06) Big strong guys. Who defends our (01:18:08) country? Big strong men. You want to (01:18:10) feel better about yourself? You want to (01:18:11) be less prone to depression. You want to (01:18:13) feel good about your mating prospects. (01:18:15) You need to get strong. We're going to (01:18:17) work out three to four times a week. (01:18:18) Two, we're going to start making some (01:18:20) money. You got a smartphone, you can (01:18:22) make money in this economy. I don't care (01:18:23) if you're a lift driver. I don't care if (01:18:24) you're a task rabbit. Going to a Panera. (01:18:26) I was on the board of Panera. If you (01:18:27) show up when you're supposed to show up (01:18:30) three times in a row, you can be making (01:18:31) 18 to 20 bucks an hour in about a month (01:18:34) because you're going to get a taste for (01:18:35) the flesh. You're going to find out that (01:18:36) money is amazing. And when you start (01:18:38) making money, you start getting good at (01:18:40) it. You start figuring out what are the (01:18:42) behaviors that get rewarded for money. (01:18:45) Where are the opportunities? And then (01:18:46) when you find when you buy [ __ ] it gets (01:18:48) your greed glands going and you start (01:18:50) thinking about, I'd really like to go on (01:18:51) another date. I'd really like to be able (01:18:53) to buy my mom something. You get a taste (01:18:55) for the flesh of money. The way you make (01:18:57) a lot of money is by starting to make a (01:18:59) little bit of money. No one starts off (01:19:01) making 100 grand a year. Most of us have (01:19:02) had jobs where we're making no money. (01:19:05) And then the third thing we're going to (01:19:06) do is two times a week we're going to (01:19:09) find ourselves in the company of (01:19:10) strangers in the agency of something (01:19:12) bigger than ourselves. Church, (01:19:14) nonprofit, a riding class, homeless (01:19:17) shelter, anything in the agency of (01:19:19) something else. And here's what we're (01:19:21) going to do after a month of that where (01:19:23) the exercise. This is kind of (01:19:26) 3A. I want you to approach a stranger (01:19:28) and express interest in friendship or (01:19:32) this is a hard one. Express romantic (01:19:34) interest while making that person feel (01:19:35) safe, right? Hey, do you want to watch (01:19:38) the game this weekend? Let's go to the (01:19:39) pub. Arsenal's playing. Liver cool. Do (01:19:40) you want to go? Hey, would you like to (01:19:42) have coffee? An attractive woman or a (01:19:44) woman you're attracted to. She's not (01:19:45) dumb. She realizes, okay, you're (01:19:47) probably interested in her. And that's (01:19:49) not the goal. The goal is the following. (01:19:51) The goal is no. you're probably going to (01:19:54) get a no. They'll be nice, but they'll (01:19:55) probably say no. Right? And I'm going to (01:19:58) call you the next day and I'm gonna ask (01:20:00) you if you're okay. And this is what (01:20:01) you're going to say. Yeah, I'm fine. And (01:20:03) that's the key. The key to success is (01:20:05) no. Because you're going to realize, (01:20:08) you're going to realize that the people (01:20:09) who are successful, who have romantic (01:20:11) partners, who have economic success, had (01:20:14) a [ __ ] ton of nos to get to that point (01:20:16) of success. This is the scariest stat (01:20:19) I've read. 51% of 18 to 24 year old (01:20:21) males have never asked a woman out in (01:20:24) person. Think about that. They don't (01:20:27) have the confidence or the skills to (01:20:29) approach a woman and ask her out. That's (01:20:32) it. The goal is the no. Cuz you get (01:20:34) enough nos, eventually you're going to (01:20:35) get a yes. I can't tell you how much (01:20:37) rejection I have endured from women. And (01:20:39) the reason I am with a really high (01:20:41) character, hot person is because I got (01:20:44) comfortable with no. I have a question, (01:20:46) Scott. I love the recommendations you (01:20:49) get you've given to men as a parent. (01:20:52) There's parents at home listening to (01:20:53) this. They're raising like pre-teen (01:20:55) adolescence. What are the things that (01:20:57) they can do to kind of push their sons (01:21:01) around along the right track? Is it (01:21:04) delaying giving them a smartphone? Is it (01:21:06) putting them in clubs? Not all boys are (01:21:08) athletic. Do you know what I mean? I (01:21:09) think No, I'm laughing because my mom (01:21:11) made me work at home. Oh, so you had (01:21:14) like No, no. to to what you're saying (01:21:16) and I I just laughed thinking of it now (01:21:18) because of what you asked and what you (01:21:19) said. My mom I think intuitively sort of (01:21:22) figured it out. I couldn't get a job at (01:21:24) a Panera. South Africa was different in (01:21:26) that way. But she made me work at home. (01:21:30) So she went there were tasks and things (01:21:32) that we need done and like you know some (01:21:34) are physical some Yeah. But she paid me (01:21:36) and she was like this is your and then (01:21:38) she made me pay rent to live in the (01:21:40) house. No, really. And she was like, (01:21:42) "This is your portion of groceries." (01:21:44) Even and it was this weird cycle. Even (01:21:45) though she was giving me the And I (01:21:47) remember asking her, I said, "This is (01:21:48) ridiculous. The money's going back. (01:21:49) You're giving me the money that I'm then (01:21:51) giving back to you to then have the (01:21:52) thing." And she said, "Yes, honey. (01:21:54) That's all money in the world." She (01:21:56) said, "That's literally what it's going (01:21:57) to be. Your company's going to give you (01:21:58) the money that you're then going to buy (01:22:00) their product with and give it back to (01:22:02) them and then you're going to give the (01:22:03) government tax that they're going to (01:22:04) then give you back with a road." She (01:22:06) said, "That's how money works. I want (01:22:07) you to get used to the reality of But (01:22:09) I'm sorry that it just made me think of (01:22:10) that parents do. Do as I say, not as I (01:22:14) do. I have not figured this out. I have (01:22:16) I have kids my kids have done really (01:22:19) well, but I Oh, well then you have (01:22:20) figured something out. Well, but to be (01:22:23) clear, they they have at different parts (01:22:25) of their life struggled with device (01:22:26) addiction. You think if anyone would (01:22:28) understand technology, it's me. I have (01:22:29) kids who sneak into the bathroom and are (01:22:32) on TikTok and I have to bang on the door (01:22:34) and say, "Start masturbating. Get off (01:22:35) your phone." (01:22:37) Um, but look, the basics, right? I think (01:22:40) the key for parents is what I call I (01:22:42) think quality time was something (01:22:43) invented by executives who weren't (01:22:45) spending a lot of time with their kids. (01:22:46) I think the key is garbage time. I'll (01:22:48) always take my kids, drive them (01:22:50) somewhere because what I find the (01:22:51) moments of (01:22:53) real value and real emotional connection (01:22:56) unfortunately happen totally randomly. (01:22:58) Yeah. You can't force them or predict (01:23:00) them. You're taking your kid to school (01:23:02) and he says, "I asked this girl out." (01:23:04) I'm like, "What happened?" and he talks (01:23:06) to you about it or I I don't think (01:23:08) there's any replacement for just a lot (01:23:10) of time. And then what you were talking (01:23:11) about chores, I've done a terrible job (01:23:13) with that. I think sports and fitness is (01:23:16) really important for kids. I think kids, (01:23:18) especially boys, are like dogs. A tired (01:23:20) boy is a better behaved boy. I think (01:23:22) they just need to sweat and they need I (01:23:25) mean, I have boys, so I'm not as in (01:23:27) touch with what with what girls need. (01:23:30) And then the other thing that I've had (01:23:32) trouble figuring out is letting them (01:23:36) fail. My son was going to a party at the (01:23:40) Westfield Mall. My, you know, kids are (01:23:41) really into malls at 14. And it ends up (01:23:44) there's two Westfields in London and I (01:23:46) got an Uber and I sent him to the wrong (01:23:47) one. So there's a (01:23:49) shield bush one. Yeah. So immediately (01:23:52) it's like his mom wants to call MI6. (01:23:54) He's texting me. Dad, you're an idiot. (01:23:58) His mom calling me. I can't believe you (01:24:00) did this. And finally, I blew up and by (01:24:02) accident did the right thing. I said to (01:24:04) my kid, I'm like, you have an Uber app. (01:24:08) You have Google Maps. You have an Oyster (01:24:10) card. Figure it out. I'm done. Mom, he's (01:24:16) going to be just fine. When I was my (01:24:18) kid's age, I used to leave my mom's (01:24:19) house with a Schwin bike and Aba Zaba (01:24:21) bar and 35 cents, and I would literally (01:24:23) come home 14 hours later, and I had to (01:24:27) navigate bullies. I had to navigate (01:24:29) stray dogs and I failed a lot and I (01:24:32) realized this is absolutely the right (01:24:34) thing to do. Jonathan height who's my (01:24:37) colleague he summarized it perfectly. We (01:24:40) overprotect them offline and we (01:24:41) underprotect them online. I am trying to (01:24:44) do a better job of letting my boys fail. (01:24:48) All right, that's a bad idea. If you ask (01:24:50) my advice, I'll tell you it's a bad (01:24:52) idea, but okay, have at it. You think (01:24:54) you can go to soccer practice without (01:24:56) shoes? just see how that works out. Have (01:24:59) at it. I'm trying to do a better job of (01:25:02) letting them fail because if you look at (01:25:03) what happens at the freshman year at (01:25:05) NYU, we have real issues now around (01:25:08) depression and self harm. And it's for (01:25:12) two reasons. One, and this is Jonathan's (01:25:14) balwick, because they're on social media (01:25:16) and they have a lack of self-esteem, (01:25:18) especially girls. And two, we have (01:25:21) created so much um bulldozer parenting (01:25:24) and concierge parenting that we've used (01:25:26) so many sanitary wipes on their lives (01:25:28) that they don't develop their own (01:25:29) immunities. And they show up to freshman (01:25:32) at college and they get their heart (01:25:33) broken or they get their first C and (01:25:35) they literally freak out. So by the time (01:25:38) I got to college, I don't know like for (01:25:39) you, I had failed a lot and I was I had (01:25:42) thick skick skin, but I had calluses. (01:25:44) Yeah. So, I'm trying to do chores, (01:25:46) athletics, a ton of garbage, and letting (01:25:49) them fail. But I want to be clear. I (01:25:52) struggle. I have outsized emotional (01:25:54) reactions. I get too angry at my kids. I (01:25:57) say things I shouldn't. I overprotect. I (01:26:00) underprotect. I'm not I am still trying (01:26:03) to figure it out. We're all trying to (01:26:05) figure it out. And that's why we're (01:26:07) here. There you go. Scott Galloway, (01:26:08) thank you very much, man. Thank you for (01:26:10) making the time. Thank you for braving (01:26:12) the journey. That was fun. This was (01:26:14) really amazing. Thank you. Thanks very (01:26:15) much. (01:26:20) [Music] (01:26:26) [Music]